Welcome
Username or Email:

Password:


Missing Code




[ ]
[ ]
Online
  • Guests: 22
  • Members: 0
  • Newest Member: omjtest
  • Most ever online: 396
    Guests: 396, Members: 0 on 12 Jan : 12:51
Members Birthdays:
No birthdays today

Next birthdays
11/29 Sonic (58)
11/29 kamelryttarn (46)
11/30 arnsfelt (45)
Contact
If you need assistance, please send an email to forum at 4hv dot org. To ensure your email is not marked as spam, please include the phrase "4hv help" in the subject line. You can also find assistance via IRC, at irc.shadowworld.net, room #hvcomm.
Support 4hv.org!
Donate:
4hv.org is hosted on a dedicated server. Unfortunately, this server costs and we rely on the help of site members to keep 4hv.org running. Please consider donating. We will place your name on the thanks list and you'll be helping to keep 4hv.org alive and free for everyone. Members whose names appear in red bold have donated recently. Green bold denotes those who have recently donated to keep the server carbon neutral.


Special Thanks To:
  • Aaron Holmes
  • Aaron Wheeler
  • Adam Horden
  • Alan Scrimgeour
  • Andre
  • Andrew Haynes
  • Anonymous000
  • asabase
  • Austin Weil
  • barney
  • Barry
  • Bert Hickman
  • Bill Kukowski
  • Blitzorn
  • Brandon Paradelas
  • Bruce Bowling
  • BubeeMike
  • Byong Park
  • Cesiumsponge
  • Chris F.
  • Chris Hooper
  • Corey Worthington
  • Derek Woodroffe
  • Dalus
  • Dan Strother
  • Daniel Davis
  • Daniel Uhrenholt
  • datasheetarchive
  • Dave Billington
  • Dave Marshall
  • David F.
  • Dennis Rogers
  • drelectrix
  • Dr. John Gudenas
  • Dr. Spark
  • E.TexasTesla
  • eastvoltresearch
  • Eirik Taylor
  • Erik Dyakov
  • Erlend^SE
  • Finn Hammer
  • Firebug24k
  • GalliumMan
  • Gary Peterson
  • George Slade
  • GhostNull
  • Gordon Mcknight
  • Graham Armitage
  • Grant
  • GreySoul
  • Henry H
  • IamSmooth
  • In memory of Leo Powning
  • Jacob Cash
  • James Howells
  • James Pawson
  • Jeff Greenfield
  • Jeff Thomas
  • Jesse Frost
  • Jim Mitchell
  • jlr134
  • Joe Mastroianni
  • John Forcina
  • John Oberg
  • John Willcutt
  • Jon Newcomb
  • klugesmith
  • Leslie Wright
  • Lutz Hoffman
  • Mads Barnkob
  • Martin King
  • Mats Karlsson
  • Matt Gibson
  • Matthew Guidry
  • mbd
  • Michael D'Angelo
  • Mikkel
  • mileswaldron
  • mister_rf
  • Neil Foster
  • Nick de Smith
  • Nick Soroka
  • nicklenorp
  • Nik
  • Norman Stanley
  • Patrick Coleman
  • Paul Brodie
  • Paul Jordan
  • Paul Montgomery
  • Ped
  • Peter Krogen
  • Peter Terren
  • PhilGood
  • Richard Feldman
  • Robert Bush
  • Royce Bailey
  • Scott Fusare
  • Scott Newman
  • smiffy
  • Stella
  • Steven Busic
  • Steve Conner
  • Steve Jones
  • Steve Ward
  • Sulaiman
  • Thomas Coyle
  • Thomas A. Wallace
  • Thomas W
  • Timo
  • Torch
  • Ulf Jonsson
  • vasil
  • Vaxian
  • vladi mazzilli
  • wastehl
  • Weston
  • William Kim
  • William N.
  • William Stehl
  • Wesley Venis
The aforementioned have contributed financially to the continuing triumph of 4hv.org. They are deserving of my most heartfelt thanks.
Forums
4hv.org :: Forums :: Projects
« Previous topic | Next topic »   

Structured Light Experiments (LiDAR Attempt).

1 2 3 4  last
Move Thread LAN_403
Patrick
Wed Nov 21 2012, 09:26PM Print
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
I must have already lost my mind, for even considering this project.

Purpose and Goal:

To build the most capabable LiDAR possible for 50-150 US$.

As I have found the existing solutions absolutely apalling. 400 dollars to buy and dissasemble a Neato vacuum just to get a primative lidar, or spend from 1200 to 6500 US$ for a slow phase differentiating Hykouo lidar, or perhaps 20,000 US$ on a real true time-of-flight lidar.
The need for and lack of a useful lidar for hobby and professional use has now become an intolerable obstacle, if no one else can or will resolve this matter, then i guess ill have too. The problem of robot control and manuevering within human occupied or natural enviroments can only be solved through the use of LiDAR and SLAM. Therefore, without good data (from a LiDAR) it doesnt matter how good your SLAM implementation is. Thus the unavoidable need for cheap, plentiful, and capable LiDAR for robotic fleets of all types (civil and martial).

Solution:
The use of structured light, as demonstranted by the XV-11 lidar in the Neato robotic vacuum. Im hoping for assistance from SparkFun and Parrallax companies and similar minded groups and individuals. I intend for the end device to be open source as much as possible ...

Connection:
im thinking of using SPI for the conection method. So the connection will work as follows :
(Lidar with internal STM32 MCU w/SPI) --> SPI --> (End-User Embedded MCU w/SPI)
Im thinking this will be easier and faster than a crap RS-232 serial TTL 115kbps connection like inb the XV-11.

Previous Threads and Research:

Previous Threads:
Link2 <- SLAM for Dummies Like Me!!!
Link2 <- Does anyone know how these LiDARs work?
Link2 <- CSU Chico Tilt Rotor Flying Machine, (Programming and CPU, 3 of 3).

Links and Research:











Initial Idea:


1353884837 2431 FT1630 Optical

Specs for Final Device:

Range: 1 foot min, 45 feet max.
Resolution: about 1 inch
Wavelength: NIR or IR, (700nm -1000nm) [Visible (red) for initial calibration only.]
Viewable arc: 360 degrees (i hope)
Enviromental: above freezing, below 150 degree F (*Earth use only), eye safe (i hope) significant unwanted light between 700nm and 1000nm may be a problem.
Size: 4 inch cube
Power: 5v at 300-500mA

Components:

Filter: IR filter passes 700nm and longer, will suppress all visible and UV light.
Main Lens: 12mm diameter, 33mm FL, uncoated, glass.
Main Mirror: TBD, probably a tiny normal mirror cut on a tile saw.
Motor: Probably a DVD/CD motor, about 1200-3000rpm.
Laser: IR 780nm or IR 808nm, laser line, 60 degrees cut down to 20 deg by blinders. 5 and 20mW. (The line will be vertical.)
MCU:Probably STM32 F1.
Detecting Element: Panavision DLIS-2k or DLIS-4k linear pixel senor (monochromatic) [the DLIS-4k is no longer made.]

Cost:

Lasers: 11 and 14 US$
Lens: 4 to 9 US$
filter: 2 US$ (once cut to size)
Mirror: 1 US$ (estimated)
Detector: Unkown
Motor: 2-5 US$ (estimated)
MCU, and PCB: 10 US$ or less
Screws, Case, Wire and Plastic: Aproxiamtley 10 US$\

(I'm trying to keep the build cost to about 50 US$)

Data Sheets and Application Notes:

]app0002_rev_d_appnote.pdf[/file] Panavision DLIS sensor family App Note.

]pds0038revg_datasheet.pdf[/file]Panavision DLIS family Data Sheet. (DLIS-2k)

Technical Points:

A Specific Note On The Filter And Detector:
The filter that i found will pass 700nm and longer, but will block all visible and UV light. The panavision DLIS family is sensitive to a suprisingling limited amount of the IR spectrum. It has been optimised for the detection of viisble light, red specifically, for bar code and fingerprint type machine vision applications. it is insensitive to longer than 1000nm light. Therfore all light that will reach the DLIS senor will be longer than 700nm and shorter than 1000nm, a narrow 300nm passband! i am hoping this will lead to a high signal and low noise condition at the sensor plane.

And for the Lasing Physics:
Within the narrow 300nm passband there will be two possible laser light beams. either a 780nm, 5mw, NIR laser diode module, or a 808nm, 20mW, IR. Both will be line generating lasers. This line will be vertical to the sensor plane, which is horizontal. This arrangement ensures alignment and a narrow but definante fall pattern on the sensor, even with age, vibration and temperature creep.


Supporting graphs for sensor and filter:

1353555190 2431 FT1630 Irfilter
Filter, frequency/transmitivity graph.


1353555190 2431 FT1630 Qe
Frequency sensitivity of Sensor, Panavision DLIS family.


Frome the above graphs we see, the filter will pass 85% of the IR at near 800nm, the DLIS sensor is sensitive to 80% at 780nm and 75% at 808nm compared to red being 100% .
Sat Nov 24 2012, 06:41PM - 1:55AM
First Structured Light Experiments ! (Proof of concept / Technology demonstrator)

(Version 1, Type 1, Mod 10, Gen A) [Success!]


1353826098 2431 FT1630 Nf1
The Setup-up... (A poor college students optical test bench, a plywood table painted white.)


1353822414 2431 FT1630 Sbs14text
Seen in the above pic, a 12" (y-axis near) target and a 16" (y-axis, Far) Target. Which cuased a visible change of 1.4 inches in the x-axis. The camera was static for the above to pictures, however the Auto Focus did jitter a bit. Still a valid test.


1353848104 3792 FT147037 Pic
Animated .gif file! Click Me!



1353831283 2431 FT1630 Li1two
Electro-Optical and physical configuration of the would-be sensor.


1353833490 2431 FT1630 Sharpie
Far target, a Sharpie paint marker.


1353833490 2431 FT1630 Solder
Near target, a tube of silver solder.

Lesson learned:
As expected, the width of the laser line as it falls on the DLIS sensor will deteremin the possible vs. actual resolution, as each pixel is
only 4 micrometers wide... (if the laser lights up several pixels, that reduces resolution.)

EDIT: its 1:40am and im drunk, so i might be \wrong, but CAD is indicating i can get the laser width down to 12um at the sensor plane, so that means 3 or 4 pixels will be lit buy my 2mm wide line laser beam... thus about 1 inch of resolution should be possible.
Back to top
Josh Campbell
Wed Nov 21 2012, 09:31PM
Josh Campbell Registered Member #5258 Joined: Sun Jun 10 2012, 10:15PM
Location: Missouri - USA
Posts: 119
Very cool. Do you have a starting point and any other details or specs.
Back to top
Patrick
Wed Nov 21 2012, 10:26PM
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
2bytes wrote ...

Very cool. Do you have a starting point and any other details or specs.
yes a whole bunch, but im late for Calculus 3B ATM.







Back to top
Shrad
Thu Nov 22 2012, 07:40AM
Shrad Registered Member #3215 Joined: Sun Sept 19 2010, 08:42PM
Location:
Posts: 780
to be eye-safe you have to be around 2000nm or more, if I recall

I would try to source a pulsed laser diode (like those in the same form factor as LEDs) as you can pulse train them and they are cheaper , but I don't know if they exist in this wavelength range

closest affordable model in CW is this one Link2
Back to top
Pinky's Brain
Thu Nov 22 2012, 12:21PM
Pinky&#039;s Brain Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
Location:
Posts: 837
IANALE ... but I think with the lenticular/rod lens (to make a line) it's going to be eye safe unless you put your eye right in front or use a loupe.

PS. you can get IR lasers for 10s of bucks on ebay ... upto multi-watt engraving lasers. Even if you want a semi-reputable store something like Roithner is a better one to go looking for bargains (1310nm diodes are cheap, because they are mass produced for fiber communication).
Back to top
Patrick
Thu Nov 22 2012, 04:45PM
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
Pinky's Brain wrote ...

IANALE
dont know what this means.

Pinky's Brain wrote ...

... but I think with the lenticular/rod lens (to make a line) it's going to be eye safe unless you put your eye right in front or use a loupe.
I was hoping so, it will be pretty diffuse by the time a human gets in its way.
Pinky's Brain wrote ...


PS. you can get IR lasers for 10s of bucks on ebay ... upto multi-watt engraving lasers. Even if you want a semi-reputable store something like Roithner is a better one to go looking for bargains (1310nm diodes are cheap, because they are mass produced for fiber communication).
the sensor wont detect longer than 1000nm IR...
Back to top
Pinky's Brain
Thu Nov 22 2012, 11:11PM
Pinky&#039;s Brain Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
Location:
Posts: 837
I Am Not A Laser Engineer/Expert ...

There are a lot of cheap laser diodes both at Roithner and Ebay between 800 and 1000 as well.

BTW, pulsed lighting is rather interesting since the sensor can have very short sampling times ... it will reduce the impact of motion and decreases the average power.
Back to top
Patrick
Fri Nov 23 2012, 03:41AM
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
Pinky's Brain wrote ...

BTW, pulsed lighting is rather interesting since the sensor can have very short sampling times ... it will reduce the impact of motion and decreases the average power.
yes i realized this and plan to strobe the transmit and recieve at each needed inveral...
Back to top
Shrad
Fri Nov 23 2012, 12:10PM
Shrad Registered Member #3215 Joined: Sun Sept 19 2010, 08:42PM
Location:
Posts: 780
there are risks, and it's controlled by the CDRH

your device would be considered as a laser scanning device and there is a MPE (max permissible exposure) and other fail-safe concerns

read this carefully : Link2

and get other resources from their website about security

IR starts being eye-safe around 1500~2000nm as it's being absorbed by the eye surface rather than the retina (transparency of the eye cristaline)
Back to top
Patrick
Sun Nov 25 2012, 02:41AM
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
Data sheets and app notes added to top thread...

look! -- commented pics!

Back to top
1 2 3 4  last

Moderator(s): Chris Russell, Noelle, Alex, Tesladownunder, Dave Marshall, Dave Billington, Bjørn, Steve Conner, Wolfram, Kizmo, Mads Barnkob

Go to:

Powered by e107 Forum System
 
Legal Information
This site is powered by e107, which is released under the GNU GPL License. All work on this site, except where otherwise noted, is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 2.5 License. By submitting any information to this site, you agree that anything submitted will be so licensed. Please read our Disclaimer and Policies page for information on your rights and responsibilities regarding this site.