If you need assistance, please send an email to forum at 4hv dot org. To ensure your email is not marked as spam, please include the phrase "4hv help" in the subject line. You can also find assistance via IRC, at irc.shadowworld.net, room #hvcomm.
Support 4hv.org!
Donate:
4hv.org is hosted on a dedicated server. Unfortunately, this server costs and we rely on the help of site members to keep 4hv.org running. Please consider donating. We will place your name on the thanks list and you'll be helping to keep 4hv.org alive and free for everyone. Members whose names appear in red bold have donated recently. Green bold denotes those who have recently donated to keep the server carbon neutral.
Special Thanks To:
Aaron Holmes
Aaron Wheeler
Adam Horden
Alan Scrimgeour
Andre
Andrew Haynes
Anonymous000
asabase
Austin Weil
barney
Barry
Bert Hickman
Bill Kukowski
Blitzorn
Brandon Paradelas
Bruce Bowling
BubeeMike
Byong Park
Cesiumsponge
Chris F.
Chris Hooper
Corey Worthington
Derek Woodroffe
Dalus
Dan Strother
Daniel Davis
Daniel Uhrenholt
datasheetarchive
Dave Billington
Dave Marshall
David F.
Dennis Rogers
drelectrix
Dr. John Gudenas
Dr. Spark
E.TexasTesla
eastvoltresearch
Eirik Taylor
Erik Dyakov
Erlend^SE
Finn Hammer
Firebug24k
GalliumMan
Gary Peterson
George Slade
GhostNull
Gordon Mcknight
Graham Armitage
Grant
GreySoul
Henry H
IamSmooth
In memory of Leo Powning
Jacob Cash
James Howells
James Pawson
Jeff Greenfield
Jeff Thomas
Jesse Frost
Jim Mitchell
jlr134
Joe Mastroianni
John Forcina
John Oberg
John Willcutt
Jon Newcomb
klugesmith
Leslie Wright
Lutz Hoffman
Mads Barnkob
Martin King
Mats Karlsson
Matt Gibson
Matthew Guidry
mbd
Michael D'Angelo
Mikkel
mileswaldron
mister_rf
Neil Foster
Nick de Smith
Nick Soroka
nicklenorp
Nik
Norman Stanley
Patrick Coleman
Paul Brodie
Paul Jordan
Paul Montgomery
Ped
Peter Krogen
Peter Terren
PhilGood
Richard Feldman
Robert Bush
Royce Bailey
Scott Fusare
Scott Newman
smiffy
Stella
Steven Busic
Steve Conner
Steve Jones
Steve Ward
Sulaiman
Thomas Coyle
Thomas A. Wallace
Thomas W
Timo
Torch
Ulf Jonsson
vasil
Vaxian
vladi mazzilli
wastehl
Weston
William Kim
William N.
William Stehl
Wesley Venis
The aforementioned have contributed financially to the continuing triumph of 4hv.org. They are deserving of my most heartfelt thanks.
Registered Member #187
Joined: Thu Feb 16 2006, 02:54PM
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 140
2Spoons wrote ...
Someone was videoing the storm and got lucky. It is entirely possible that the burning shower is not metal at all, and is in fact burning plastic from insulation covering the wire(s). That would require a lot less energy. If you step through the video you can see a dark line remaining in the middle of all that fire, suggesting (to me anyway) that there is still an intact cable there.
I can understand a lucky video capture, but the digital photograph is a fairly hi-res image, with the wire right in the perfect frame (is it right in the center?), taken right at the exact moment of the strike? VERY fishy. Too fishy for my taste.
The exposure/motion streaks of light in the windows of the buildings suggest that this image has been altered. How can you have streaks in the rest of the picture but NONE around the lightning strike, and a fairly well defined shower of sparks? (which looks suspiciously like CGI to me) Also, in one of my favorite YouTube vids, lightning strikes a power line and about 50 yards away a pole-pig blows up (I'll post a link if I can find it again). That 50-yard length of wire (at LEAST that part) should have lit up, burned, or exploded. I suppose that the higher resistance of the steel cable between those buildings could have caused it to heat up red-hot much faster, but that's speculation.
I also find it suspicious that the current travelled in both directions down the wire, but more current went down one side of the wire than the other? Lightning generally finds a path to ground and then the channel opens. I don't believe that the current would split and go both directions down that wire to ground.
Registered Member #118
Joined: Fri Feb 10 2006, 05:35AM
Location: Woodridge, Illinois, USA
Posts: 72
cbfull wrote ...
2Spoons wrote ...
Someone was videoing the storm and got lucky. It is entirely possible that the burning shower is not metal at all, and is in fact burning plastic from insulation covering the wire(s). That would require a lot less energy. If you step through the video you can see a dark line remaining in the middle of all that fire, suggesting (to me anyway) that there is still an intact cable there.
I can understand a lucky video capture, but the digital photograph is a fairly hi-res image, with the wire right in the perfect frame (is it right in the center?), taken right at the exact moment of the strike? VERY fishy. Too fishy for my taste.
The exposure/motion streaks of light in the windows of the buildings suggest that this image has been altered. How can you have streaks in the rest of the picture but NONE around the lightning strike, and a fairly well defined shower of sparks? (which looks suspiciously like CGI to me) Also, in one of my favorite YouTube vids, lightning strikes a power line and about 50 yards away a pole-pig blows up (I'll post a link if I can find it again). That 50-yard length of wire (at LEAST that part) should have lit up, burned, or exploded. I suppose that the higher resistance of a steel cable could have caused it to heat up red-hot much faster, but that's speculation.
I also find it suspicious that the current travelled in both directions down the wire, but more current went down one side of the wire than the other? Lightning generally finds a path to ground and then the channel opens. I don't believe that the current would split and go both directions down that wire to ground.
I'm not buying it.
Let's try to remove a few fish...
The original, uncropped. photo was the middle link I provided. It shows the strike and wire substantially to the left of center,
The larger, centered image (last link I provided) was (subsequently) blown up and cropped to center it. Fortunately, the photographer used a good, high resolution camera (supposedly a Nikon D9 with a 10-second exposure).
Regarding current splitting, lightning (and sparks in general) will indeed select a single preferential path when multiple leaders are propagating traveling through air. This is because an arc has a negative resistance characteristic - a "winning channel" effectively hogs the available channel current, reducing tip potential in other leader tips, and effectively starving them to death. However, if lightning hits somewhere along a suspended electrical conductor, current will indeed split. Initially, current is equally split (since the transmission line impedance is the same in either directions). However, after several line reflections from the far ends (grounded in this case), current along each path will indeed split as a function of the resistance and inductance of each path to ground. The attachment point of the strike will be elevated to a voltage equal to the total stroke current times the overall impedance of the paths connected in parallel. And, the shorter path will conduct more, but certainly not all, of the total stroke current.
Regarding smearing, is it reasonable to expect the same degree of smearing for short-duration lightning strokes versus incandescent, metal vapor, or fluorescent lighting? The still image appears to have been accidentally captured by an amateur lightning photographer, using a multi-second exposure, via a camera stabilized by a tripod. Any CG lightning flashes that might be captured during this time will be 4-5 orders of magnitude shorter that the total exposure time. This was a very energetic and loud event. It's quite possible that the acoustic shock of the thunder caused a slight shake of the camera and the resultant smearing. If so, it was likely delayed until AFTER all the flashes had come and gone. In this case, there would be no reason for the lightning bolts to be smeared. I really don't find it at all odd that the lightning stroke(s) aren't smeared...
Registered Member #2939
Joined: Fri Jun 25 2010, 04:25AM
Location:
Posts: 615
I get the impression that photo was taken through a window. So the smear could be caused by movement of the window glass - due to wind or thunder. This might also explain why there is less smear at the bottom of the picture - movement in the glass may not be uniform. As for the lack of smear in the sparks - if its a long exposure (very, very likely) there is no way of knowing when the strike was during that exposure so it may have occurred at the end, after whatever caused the rest of the lights to smear.
Registered Member #187
Joined: Thu Feb 16 2006, 02:54PM
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 140
Bert wrote ...
Let's try to remove a few fish...
...the shorter path will conduct more, but certainly not all, of the total stroke current.
Regarding smearing, is it reasonable to expect the same degree of smearing for short-duration lightning strokes versus incandescent, metal vapor, or fluorescent lighting? The still image appears to have been accidentally captured by an amateur lightning photographer, using a multi-second exposure, via a camera stabilized by a tripod. Any CG lightning flashes that might be captured during this time will be 4-5 orders of magnitude shorter that the total exposure time. This was a very energetic and loud event. It's quite possible that the acoustic shock of the thunder caused a slight shake of the camera and the resultant smearing. If so, it was likely delayed until AFTER all the flashes had come and gone. In this case, there would be no reason for the lightning bolts to be smeared. I really don't find it at all odd that the lightning stroke(s) aren't smeared...
Excellent logic. Thanks for that last sentence about the shorter wire conducting more. That's all I needed. However, I wasn't aware that anyone was particularly knowledgable about what happens to lightning current once it enters the ground. Not that I would be aware of it if it had/has been studied. Given that, your assumptions are quite reasonable and insightful. The problem here is that there is practically zero data. All conclusions must be drawn from a photo and a video, which are inherently unscientific.
Also very good job explaining your theories of the light smears. Very plausible indeed. It seemed like your post was a tad eager if I may, I just hope I didn't upset you. You didn't take the photo or know the person that took it do you? If nothing else I love that this video and photo have got me thinking. I'm not saying it's definitely fake, I'm just suspicious, nothing more. No doubt I am a bit biased (more like jaded) after watching hours and hours of faked UFO footage, all claiming to be real.
Nevertheless I remain skeptical and it has nothing to do with you or anyone else believing it is authentic. A good scientist does not draw conclusions without sufficient research. Although I admit I do have my moments!
Registered Member #3271
Joined: Mon Oct 04 2010, 02:29AM
Location: Canada
Posts: 159
Would be interesting to see metal objects in the appartments close and axial to the wire got slightly magnetised in line with the induced B field due to the current pulse in the wire.....
Registered Member #3806
Joined: Sat Apr 02 2011, 09:20PM
Location: France
Posts: 259
The youtube account hosting the video has been closed... :/ If anyone dowloaded and kept that video, please upload it as private and post link ... Thanks :)
Registered Member #96
Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 05:37PM
Location: CI, Earth
Posts: 4061
Grr. Thats a shame, the video was a nice demonstration of the power of lightning.
Methinks what we need is an automatic YT account generator which checks to see if videos can be played then if they "vanish" it creates a new account and reuploads the content sans soundtrack.
-A "Bother!" said Pooh, as he found all his white LEDs had shed their legs...
This site is powered by e107, which is released under the GNU GPL License. All work on this site, except where otherwise noted, is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 2.5 License. By submitting any information to this site, you agree that anything submitted will be so licensed. Please read our Disclaimer and Policies page for information on your rights and responsibilities regarding this site.
Natural Exploding Wire - a massive Russian lightning bolt vaporizes wire connecting two buildings
