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Government to "kill" solar energy

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Patrick

Sun Nov 13 2011, 05:58PM

Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639

Government here in the US is why solar F'ups like Solyndra happen. The government isnt the solution Its the problem, if its workable and profitable then the private sector will find the capital and tech to roll an idea out.

Investing and bailouts is not the place for the government to take part in.

@Grenidier, the bailout of Big Banks and GM is why the government thought solyndra and others were a good idea. The price of our governments medling is this... the risk becomes public, while the profits remain private, this is the slippery slope towards the communization of America. (just as the repubs are greedy for dollars, so too are the dems for power over the private sector, and to destroy individuals rights. I dont trust either group of cowards.)

Not to get all political here, but thats the way it is. Let private companies fail, or reorganize at their own expense, dont screw the public.

Sulaiman

Tue Nov 15 2011, 05:40AM

Registered Member #162 Joined: Mon Feb 13 2006, 10:25AM
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 3140

The previous subsidy was 42p per kWh (three times consumer cost)
the new rate is 21p per kWh (50% more than consumer cost)

If solar power can't make a profit at 50% more than consumer price without distribution costs, then solar power is clearly not a viable option and should be abandoned.

The only people that would have installed solar power would be the well-off,
consuming the tax money of the poor in subsidies or driving up electricity costs.
(o.k. maybe a few geeks or well-meaning folk may have invested, but not many)

Conundrum

Tue Nov 15 2011, 09:55AM

Registered Member #96 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 05:37PM
Location: CI, Earth
Posts: 4061

You are somewhat right..
However surely in this economy we should be encouraging people to fit solar energy systems due to the imminent risk of significant power disruption from solar maximum.

Just my $0.42 worth.
-A

Steve Conner

Tue Nov 15 2011, 10:12AM

Registered Member #30 Joined: Fri Feb 03 2006, 10:52AM
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 6706

Well, the link is obvious, both parts of the sentence contain the word "Solar".

The systems won't help, as they are grid-intertied. If the grid goes down, the inverters shut off too, and you're without power even if the sun is blazing. I got a whole PhD out of absurdities like this.

Nik

Wed Nov 16 2011, 03:23AM

Registered Member #53 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 04:31AM
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 638

I'm an electrician in Canada and solar power here is a scam. I have put in large (full rooftop) installations that, at peak output, can only provide 1/4 of the building's need. One of our biggest projects is a 9MW farm which is payed for in very large part by the government trying to score green points. The panels have to be tilted at least 25 degrees to be effective which makes them take up a lot more room, not only that but the overcast and snow in the winter makes them pretty useless. I wish more money would be put into other renewable energy because solar in Canada is bunk.

Nicko

Wed Nov 16 2011, 09:31AM

Registered Member #1334 Joined: Tue Feb 19 2008, 04:37PM
Location: Nr. London, UK
Posts: 615

Sulaiman wrote ...

The previous subsidy was 42p per kWh (three times consumer cost)
the new rate is 21p per kWh (50% more than consumer cost)

If solar power can't make a profit at 50% more than consumer price without distribution costs, then solar power is clearly not a viable option and should be abandoned.

The only people that would have installed solar power would be the well-off,
consuming the tax money of the poor in subsidies or driving up electricity costs.
(o.k. maybe a few geeks or well-meaning folk may have invested, but not many)

Regarding solar energy, only PV is mainly bunk - heat pumps (as I keep proselytising) are good, cheap-ish (3 to 4 year payback), work, zero-maintenance, unaffected by clouds/winter/night-time etc. yada yada...

If you want green electricity, buy it off commercial suppliers who can do it on a commercial scale where it actually does make a bit of sense - this is the advice from CAT (Centre for Alternative Technology in the UK - our premier independent "green" authority

)

Steve Conner

Wed Nov 16 2011, 09:38AM

Registered Member #30 Joined: Fri Feb 03 2006, 10:52AM
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 6706

Nick, can you explain how a ground-sourced heat pump qualifies as solar energy?

Nicko

Wed Nov 16 2011, 10:32AM

Registered Member #1334 Joined: Tue Feb 19 2008, 04:37PM
Location: Nr. London, UK
Posts: 615

Steve McConner wrote ...

Nick, can you explain how a ground-sourced heat pump qualifies as solar energy?

You are thinking of geothermal energy. Not the same thing at all.

A ground source heat pump gets all of its energy from the sun, using the ground (or a pond/lake/etc.) as a storage heater, hence ground with a "southerly aspect" is preferred...

The coils are only buried about 1 metre down - in the UK at 50N lat. the temperature at that level, assuming decent water retention in the ground, averages about 12C throughout the year. It can make a mess of the lawn:

Its solar energy, and consequently qualifies for the same government grants as those stupid things people stick on their roofs...

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