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arcing thru distilled water

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LAN_403

Arcstarter

Sat Jul 16 2011, 11:36PM

Registered Member #1225 Joined: Sat Jan 12 2008, 01:24AM
Location: Beaumont, Texas, USA
Posts: 2253

I have never tried to make arcs in water, but for low voltage DC arcs i have used inductors to draw arcs a few mm long with 12v. The inductor limits the current *somewhat* because of it's DC resistance, and i guess if the spark tries to extinguish the inductive kickback would help try to sustain the arc. I'm not sure but it sure seemed to make drawing DC arcs easier.

Pinky's Brain

Sun Jul 17 2011, 12:17AM

Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
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Posts: 837

Forty wrote ...

this sounds like a much more fun way of making silver nanoparticles for university research

Silver is more reactive though ... in the paper Proud Mary linked they had almost as much ionic silver as colloids. Also a large spread in sizes and a significant amount of particles which are too large to remain as a colloid at all. Probably some silver hydroxide and oxide in there as well.

Ash Small

Sun Jul 17 2011, 12:22AM

Registered Member #3414 Joined: Sun Nov 14 2010, 05:05PM
Location: UK
Posts: 4245

Pinky's Brain wrote ...

I wonder if the explosive evaporation of a piece of gold wire with a capacitor bank will form colloids.

.

I think the size of the capacitor bank is the controlling factor here. If the capacitor bank was 'small' it should work, but, on the other hand, a large bank might produce multiple nanoparticles. I'm not an expert, but I'm interested.

Pinky's Brain

Sun Jul 17 2011, 01:06AM

Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
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I mean really destroy the entire wire at once in one blaze of glory ... so multiple particles would be expected.

Austin the Ozone

Sun Jul 17 2011, 01:27AM

Registered Member #3989 Joined: Thu Jul 07 2011, 05:10PM
Location: In a van down by the river.
Posts: 52

Cappacitive discharge seems like might be a neat way to do it,

Gold does not make ions in water so the resistance of the water stays the same except the change from heating. The only way I know of to get gold into the water is to vaporize it with the arc. The idea is to attempt to create the smallest particles you can, I don't know how the best way is, but there are several youtube videos on the subject and they seem to like the mots, usually with a variac.

I would think picking another metal to practice on would be tricky because combining with water and making ions reduces the resistance of the water and would short out the arc eventually or just make too much heat and draw too much current. Maybe an alloy like titanium or even stainless steel might work tho.

To make the colloidal silver: The idea is to limit the current to 1 ma, using three nine volt batteries in series and a resistor. So 27 volts divided by 30,000 ohms = 0.0009 right? So a 30,000 ohm resistor? Is that right? Anyway two .999 silver wires in some distilled water that has been heated to near boiling. Heating the water reduces the resistance of the water and helps the process get started. Once it starts the ions in solution make the water conductive enough to continue even after the water has cooled. Takes all night and looks straw colored in the morning. Refrigerate or it turns cloudy. Useful for lots of things, including cuts and scrapes, underarm deodorant, bad breath. You can pour an inch of it into your stinky shoes and let them sit in the sun and they will not stink anymore when they all the water evaporates the silver will be still in your shoes. Get your clean socks wet with it and let them air dry as a remedy for stinky feet. I like that blue man youtube video, it actually made me want to try the silver more than turn me away from it. lol

Proud Mary

Sun Jul 17 2011, 06:24AM

Registered Member #543 Joined: Tue Feb 20 2007, 04:26PM
Location: UK
Posts: 4992

Austin the Ozone wrote ...

Useful for lots of things, including cuts and scrapes, underarm deodorant, bad breath. You can pour an inch of it into your stinky shoes and let them sit in the sun and they will not stink anymore when they all the water evaporates the silver will be still in your shoes. Get your clean socks wet with it and let them air dry as a remedy for stinky feet. I like that blue man youtube video, it actually made me want to try the silver more than turn me away from it. lol

There is a rapidly growing peer reviewed literature on the toxicity of silver nanoparticles.

Pinky's Brain

Sun Jul 17 2011, 07:09PM

Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
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Posts: 837

If it wasn't toxic it wouldn't be killing bacteria.

PS. surface bound nanoparticles seem like a much better idea, especially TiO2.

Proud Mary

Sun Jul 17 2011, 07:28PM

Registered Member #543 Joined: Tue Feb 20 2007, 04:26PM
Location: UK
Posts: 4992

Pinky's Brain wrote ...

If it wasn't toxic it wouldn't be killing bacteria.

Selective toxicity is one of the fundamental concepts in toxicology, and repays study.

Austin the Ozone

Sun Jul 17 2011, 07:30PM

Registered Member #3989 Joined: Thu Jul 07 2011, 05:10PM
Location: In a van down by the river.
Posts: 52

Proud Mary wrote ...

There is a rapidly growing peer reviewed literature on the toxicity of silver nanoparticles.

Well I don't know for sure if drinking it is safe but I would think it resonably harmless to apply externally in anyway you want. However if I were sick (which I'm not thankfully) and I thought that it would help me I would for sure try it versus a other unknowns that the doctors get paid to prescribe. Anyways Methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus is certainly one application that silver is appropriate for as it is resistant to antibiotics, yet silvers wide-spectrum antimicrobial activity is very effective against it. It is called oligodynamic effect

So I'm not suggesting we drink it just for the record, however I don't think it will kill you if you do.

Lets switch back to gold and drawing arcs under water for vaporizing gold. According to http://www.geotech1.com/cgi-bin/pages/common/index.pl?page=lrl&file=/info/nmr.dat gold resonates easily at earths gravity at 37 hertz, so do you guys think it would help in any way to make low frequency 37 hertz ac to make the arcs? Maybe by tyaking advantage of the capacitance in a really big transformer to resonate at that low rate or adding capacitance? Maybe an arc welder trasformer turned around backwards to be a step up transformer and then powering it with 37hz from the electrode side? Maybe thats a silly idea but I am just learning and would love to hear what you guys have to say! Thank you :)

Pinky's Brain

Sun Jul 17 2011, 09:29PM

Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
Location:
Posts: 837

I doubt NMR movement has anything at all to do with it, it's not going to tear atoms loose from the electrode ... purely a thermal erosion effect caused by electron impact heating AFAICS.

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