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Imminent demise of the U.S. economy

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LAN_403

Conundrum

Wed Feb 09 2011, 11:29PM

Registered Member #96 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 05:37PM
Location: CI, Earth
Posts: 4061

The upshot is that the entire U.S. economy is on the verge of meltdown.

Add to this the imminent eruption of Bardabunga in Iceland (due in as little as a month)

and 50 times more disruption to air travel, and you can see the entire Ponzi scheme that is the current "economy" collapsing like the house of cards it is.

Needless to say, it would make the Wall Street Crash look like a lighter next to an oil well fire.
The revolution is coming, be prepared.

-A

#include "canned_food_and_geiger_counters.h"

Pinky's Brain

Thu Feb 10 2011, 01:34AM

Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
Location:
Posts: 837

A gold standard has never prevented wealth/debt accumulation ... when left alone (ie. no progressive taxation) capitalism will tend to concentrate wealth unless there is enough economic growth to drown that effect out.

Globalization and the corresponding inability of governments to progressively tax is what is destabilizing the US/EU (if they tried progressive taxation to redistribute wealth capital flight would kill them ... import/export tariffs and prevention of foreign ownership can make capital flight impossible but globalist propaganda has been so internalized that such an anti-free trade measures can't even enter most people's head as an option any more).

That said, anyone expecting hyperinflation in the US is naive ... it's still the most productive economy in the world.

Adam Munich

Thu Feb 10 2011, 02:11AM

Registered Member #2893 Joined: Tue Jun 01 2010, 09:25PM
Location: Cali-forn. i. a.
Posts: 2242

The US is never going to become a strong nation again unless we put in some serious education reform. As much as people like to hide it, we need to face the fact that america is stupid. Case in point:

Americans don't fix things, and because of that they don't know how to fix things. That means they don't know how to build things. Because of that a lot of them don't know math. If you wanna do anything more than the bare essentials with electronics, you need pretty advanced mathematics. To really grasp thermodynamics you need to master a high level of math. Just two real world examples.

The thing is, in most of today's western countries a majority of the people do completely useless things. 80% of all office jobs could be scrapped without compromising the valuable services offered to the people. Most of our society is built on making people believe they need a service which does not provide any lasting benefit that common sense can't already offer, e.g. consultancy, marketing, management training, economical advise etc. However, those people have convinced the majority of the world they are the most important part of society. They make you believe math is useless because they want you to aim at a job which consists of selling creatively named air and to make you buy their bullshit.

Don't believe me? How else is it possible for companies to fire 50-80 percent of their staff during economic troubled times like the ones we live in now? It's because most of their staff is busy selling air to their bosses / coworkers / customers. If this recession turns into a real depression, how do you think you're going to get a job quickest? By telling a business owner "I can assess the performance of your human resources, evaluate your management strategies and consult you on reconsidering your marketing approaches" or by telling him "I can fix the machines which keep your plant running"?

If you're planning on making a living selling air you don't need math. But it's not my problem if you can't find a job. If you're learning a trade, like welding, plumbing, masoning, you don't need much math either. But if you wanna become one of the people who design, build and maintain the intricate machines which feed us, clothe us, heal us and basically keep us happy while most of us are selling air, you need math and you will always have a job.

Just my $0.02

Pinky's Brain

Thu Feb 10 2011, 02:41AM

Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
Location:
Posts: 837

It's no different anywhere else ... China isn't growing so fast because they have more/better engineers, it's because they have peasants which can work cheaper than robots. Also they use their currency to keep their workers poor.

If I had to hazard a guess about the country with the most private machine shops per capita the US would be top of my list. You're underselling Americans and overselling everyone else IMO.

BTW ... machines are being kept running now. In a depression, with demand falling there will be less produced, less need to fix/make machines to produce things. The real opportunities in a depression is in getting the best deals in bankruptcies ... not making things.

klugesmith

Thu Feb 10 2011, 03:24AM

Registered Member #2099 Joined: Wed Apr 29 2009, 12:22AM
Location: Los Altos, California
Posts: 1716

Conundrum wrote ...
The revolution is coming, be prepared.

Some would say: time to stock up on precious metals.
Gold and silver can wait; start with plenty of lead and the tools to apply it.

Carbon_Rod

Thu Feb 10 2011, 09:31AM

Registered Member #65 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 06:43AM
Location:
Posts: 1155

I am not generally one to respond to baseless rhetoric, but here is some facts to consider.

1.
Democratized economies were not designed to deal with corporate entities surviving more the 20 years.

2.
Education is not critical thinking given US political candidates run campaigns based on nonsense.
Macroeconomics has proven countless times that "what is good for the individual... is not necessarily good for society."
For example, the current measure of "Wealth" is based on transactional volume excluding military pay and allowances (a large portion of government expenditure in the US). Thus, if a disaster like an Oil-Spill/flood/war/Godzilla forces individuals to decrease their marginal propensity to save - it actually improves the economy overall. However, note that peoples' standard of living falls as the economy recovers in this scenario.
Additionally, note "trickle down" economics are an illusion as the marginal propensity to save increases with the more expendable income an individual retains.

3.
How does "Chicken Little"/Media-Bulls**t-factories fit into the equation?
Again, the economy was based on consumers understanding their own local economic needs. If a society believes their is a "pending crash" than the marginal propensity to save will shift again towards less spending, and thus reduce the overall market activity. Therefore, a popular credible individual/corporation can actually generate the very effect they claim to predict by slowing market recovery.

4.
Market manipulation, tax breaks, and bank savings will drive inflation... Gold fools or Poor people with guns will have a false sense of security, and can shoot themselves in the foot twice.

5.
Outsourcing, free-trade, and manufacturing relocation killed the unions - but made a few people quite rich. Did you go to university to compete for a $12/h job? that's how much engineers cost in China. How about $8/h? that's how much they cost in India.
Countless midsized companies move entire facilities including future skill endowments offshore, and thus create a negative externalization on the community they operate in. You see, the people will have to work harder for less to compete in a game of demand deficient labor pools.

The middle class was a dream sold to a world of desperate men for the wage of a peasant.

Individuals will know this is true, but people in general won't care unless it directly affects their earnings.

troll+5

Pinky's Brain

Thu Feb 10 2011, 12:15PM

Registered Member #2901 Joined: Thu Jun 03 2010, 01:25PM
Location:
Posts: 837

Klugesmith wrote ...

Gold and silver can wait; start with plenty of lead and the tools to apply it.

If you have the money and you really expect complete economic and societal collapse you need to buy a home in the wilderness and stock it. A little bit of lead is nice, but being able to avoid the lead flying around would be a much bigger priority.

As for gold, it prepares you for fuck all ... the fact it will always have some value is a fools argument. Gasoline, toilet paper and canned goods will always have some value ... but they have value prone to increase after societal breakdown, so why exactly hoard gold?

Gold as an investment 2 years ago, great idea ... gold as an investment now, shaky idea. The democrats losing majority has made Bernanke's position shaky, and he is the only thing keeping inflation up.

Steve Conner

Thu Feb 10 2011, 01:38PM

Registered Member #30 Joined: Fri Feb 03 2006, 10:52AM
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 6706

I thought Klugesmith meant the lead to be used for lining your fallout shelter.

klugesmith

Thu Feb 10 2011, 04:25PM

Registered Member #2099 Joined: Wed Apr 29 2009, 12:22AM
Location: Los Altos, California
Posts: 1716

Steve McConner wrote ...
I thought Klugesmith meant the lead to be used for lining your fallout shelter.

Oops, sorry. I originally heard it as "save precious metals: gold, silver, and lead" with a clear implication that the last was in the form of ammunition.

Conundrum

Thu Feb 10 2011, 06:26PM

Registered Member #96 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 05:37PM
Location: CI, Earth
Posts: 4061

stocking up on items suitable for building rapid prototyping machines would be useful, as these would be essential in the event of a large scale breakdown in the air and sea goods transport system.

After all, what good are expensive machines if you can't fix them?

-A

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