Welcome
Username or Email:

Password:


Missing Code




[ ]
[ ]
Online
  • Guests: 55
  • Members: 0
  • Newest Member: omjtest
  • Most ever online: 396
    Guests: 396, Members: 0 on 12 Jan : 12:51
Members Birthdays:
All today's birthdays', congrats!
Bead (41)
Fumeaux (25)


Next birthdays
04/28 Steve Conner (46)
04/29 GODSFUSION (37)
04/29 Zajcek (37)
Contact
If you need assistance, please send an email to forum at 4hv dot org. To ensure your email is not marked as spam, please include the phrase "4hv help" in the subject line. You can also find assistance via IRC, at irc.shadowworld.net, room #hvcomm.
Support 4hv.org!
Donate:
4hv.org is hosted on a dedicated server. Unfortunately, this server costs and we rely on the help of site members to keep 4hv.org running. Please consider donating. We will place your name on the thanks list and you'll be helping to keep 4hv.org alive and free for everyone. Members whose names appear in red bold have donated recently. Green bold denotes those who have recently donated to keep the server carbon neutral.


Special Thanks To:
  • Aaron Holmes
  • Aaron Wheeler
  • Adam Horden
  • Alan Scrimgeour
  • Andre
  • Andrew Haynes
  • Anonymous000
  • asabase
  • Austin Weil
  • barney
  • Barry
  • Bert Hickman
  • Bill Kukowski
  • Blitzorn
  • Brandon Paradelas
  • Bruce Bowling
  • BubeeMike
  • Byong Park
  • Cesiumsponge
  • Chris F.
  • Chris Hooper
  • Corey Worthington
  • Derek Woodroffe
  • Dalus
  • Dan Strother
  • Daniel Davis
  • Daniel Uhrenholt
  • datasheetarchive
  • Dave Billington
  • Dave Marshall
  • David F.
  • Dennis Rogers
  • drelectrix
  • Dr. John Gudenas
  • Dr. Spark
  • E.TexasTesla
  • eastvoltresearch
  • Eirik Taylor
  • Erik Dyakov
  • Erlend^SE
  • Finn Hammer
  • Firebug24k
  • GalliumMan
  • Gary Peterson
  • George Slade
  • GhostNull
  • Gordon Mcknight
  • Graham Armitage
  • Grant
  • GreySoul
  • Henry H
  • IamSmooth
  • In memory of Leo Powning
  • Jacob Cash
  • James Howells
  • James Pawson
  • Jeff Greenfield
  • Jeff Thomas
  • Jesse Frost
  • Jim Mitchell
  • jlr134
  • Joe Mastroianni
  • John Forcina
  • John Oberg
  • John Willcutt
  • Jon Newcomb
  • klugesmith
  • Leslie Wright
  • Lutz Hoffman
  • Mads Barnkob
  • Martin King
  • Mats Karlsson
  • Matt Gibson
  • Matthew Guidry
  • mbd
  • Michael D'Angelo
  • Mikkel
  • mileswaldron
  • mister_rf
  • Neil Foster
  • Nick de Smith
  • Nick Soroka
  • nicklenorp
  • Nik
  • Norman Stanley
  • Patrick Coleman
  • Paul Brodie
  • Paul Jordan
  • Paul Montgomery
  • Ped
  • Peter Krogen
  • Peter Terren
  • PhilGood
  • Richard Feldman
  • Robert Bush
  • Royce Bailey
  • Scott Fusare
  • Scott Newman
  • smiffy
  • Stella
  • Steven Busic
  • Steve Conner
  • Steve Jones
  • Steve Ward
  • Sulaiman
  • Thomas Coyle
  • Thomas A. Wallace
  • Thomas W
  • Timo
  • Torch
  • Ulf Jonsson
  • vasil
  • Vaxian
  • vladi mazzilli
  • wastehl
  • Weston
  • William Kim
  • William N.
  • William Stehl
  • Wesley Venis
The aforementioned have contributed financially to the continuing triumph of 4hv.org. They are deserving of my most heartfelt thanks.
Forums
4hv.org :: Forums :: Tesla Coils
« Previous topic | Next topic »   

Coil not working after replacing dead IGBT

1 2 
Move Thread LAN_403
nzoomed
Sun Jul 30 2017, 10:19PM Print
nzoomed Registered Member #54503 Joined: Sun Feb 22 2015, 10:35PM
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 288
Hi everyone, just getting back to my project after many months.
I ended up buying another IGBT off ebay and reassembled my coil again today.

No idea what's wrong, but my coil is no longer working since one of the IGBT's died.

Is there anything else i should be checking after an IGBT failure?
I believe the failure was caused on a floating gate, as i discovered that one of the cat 5 wires from the GDT had broken off the failed IGBT.

Im still getting a signal on the scope on the GDT outputs and on the bridge output itself also.


The scope shot below is taken from across the bridge, and the odd thing is i get the same waveform even if i remove the power from the bus!

Dont know whats going on here, but i think i might try and inject a signal from the signal generator into the UD board and see if that makes any difference. Right now my MIDI interrupter is simply emulating a spark gap coil in this screenshot.

Either way, i can hear the GDT making the usual buzzing noise when its being driven, so the feedback driver must be doing something right.
Any ideas?

Do TVS diodes usually short circuit if they fail? Thats the only thing i did not check when reassembling.
TIA
1501453183 54503 FT0 20170722 171552
Back to top
Pac85hv
Sun Jul 30 2017, 10:27PM
Pac85hv Registered Member #56972 Joined: Sat Sept 05 2015, 09:43PM
Location:
Posts: 10
What kind of signal do you get between the gate and the emitters? Are you sure you got the gdt phasing right?
Back to top
nzoomed
Sun Jul 30 2017, 11:21PM
nzoomed Registered Member #54503 Joined: Sun Feb 22 2015, 10:35PM
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 288
Pac85hv wrote ...

What kind of signal do you get between the gate and the emitters? Are you sure you got the gdt phasing right?

I was getting an almost identical signal to this on the scope across the gates.

I thought about the phasing, but ive never changed any of that, its all back 100% the same as it was.
I even compared it to the photos i took during construction.
Back to top
Mads Barnkob
Mon Jul 31 2017, 08:36AM
Mads Barnkob Registered Member #1403 Joined: Tue Mar 18 2008, 06:05PM
Location: Denmark, Odense C
Posts: 1968
When IGBTs explode in a Tesla coil, the GDT provides excelent protection to the driver, so this is not the first place to look for faulty components.

Start by taking the bridge completely apart and measure each component individually.

Gate resistors, zener diodes, diodes, IGBTs, everything. I have often seen gate resistors either go open circuit or very high resistance after a IGBT failure.
Back to top
nzoomed
Mon Jul 31 2017, 11:53AM
nzoomed Registered Member #54503 Joined: Sun Feb 22 2015, 10:35PM
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 288
Mads Barnkob wrote ...

When IGBTs explode in a Tesla coil, the GDT provides excelent protection to the driver, so this is not the first place to look for faulty components.

Start by taking the bridge completely apart and measure each component individually.

Gate resistors, zener diodes, diodes, IGBTs, everything. I have often seen gate resistors either go open circuit or very high resistance after a IGBT failure.


OK, good point, I did not even think that those may have failed, i will test them tomorrow if i get a chance :)
Back to top
Pac85hv
Mon Jul 31 2017, 02:01PM
Pac85hv Registered Member #56972 Joined: Sat Sept 05 2015, 09:43PM
Location:
Posts: 10
That waveform is absolutely unacceptable, there must be something wrong with wither the gdt, the gate resistors and diodes ecc. or maybe your driver is outputting a very low frequency signal because it as no feedback(there can't be any feedback if the bridge is not powered and if the primary circuit is disconnected), you should try attaching a signal generator to the signal input of your driver.
That kind of wave is dangerous for the IGBTs during operation, they will dissipate too much power and explode.
Back to top
nzoomed
Tue Aug 01 2017, 10:03PM
nzoomed Registered Member #54503 Joined: Sun Feb 22 2015, 10:35PM
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 288
Pac85hv wrote ...

That waveform is absolutely unacceptable, there must be something wrong with wither the gdt, the gate resistors and diodes ecc. or maybe your driver is outputting a very low frequency signal because it as no feedback(there can't be any feedback if the bridge is not powered and if the primary circuit is disconnected), you should try attaching a signal generator to the signal input of your driver.
That kind of wave is dangerous for the IGBTs during operation, they will dissipate too much power and explode.

I was testing on low voltage, but yes i will check it this week when i have time to see if the gate resistors and are OK
Back to top
nzoomed
Sat Aug 05 2017, 03:46AM
nzoomed Registered Member #54503 Joined: Sun Feb 22 2015, 10:35PM
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 288
OK, a quick update, the TVS diodes i had across the gates must have also failed when the IGBT died. I put the meter across them and they are both short circuiting!
It did cross my mind whether or not they would be OK or not after an IGBT failure, but assumed they would have gone open circuit rather than short circuit. Anyway i will try the coil with them removed and hopefully it will be safe enough for a short time running without the TVS clamps.
I do see now that various TVS clamps have different failure modes, so will be interesting to see the datasheet for these ones.

These are the TVS clamps im using.
Link2
Just to rule out any possility on future IGBT failures, is it likely that these died as a result of the IGBT failing or could have one of these failed TVS diodes lead to the IGBT failure if it shorted the gates?
Back to top
futurist
Sat Aug 05 2017, 03:14PM
futurist Registered Member #61400 Joined: Sun Jan 01 2017, 01:01PM
Location:
Posts: 33
TVS shorting due to igbt failure is more likely, especially if you found gdt leads detached

If tvs did short one igbt gate the driver couldn't continue to run other igbts normally which could lead to brick failure?

This is gdt output when other secondary is unloaded

1501945939 61400 FT180251 Gdt1


Same gdt output when other one is shorted

1501945939 61400 FT180251 Gdt2
Back to top
nzoomed
Sat Aug 05 2017, 10:14PM
nzoomed Registered Member #54503 Joined: Sun Feb 22 2015, 10:35PM
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 288
OK, well I fired it up at a low bus voltage and it started to work again with the shorted TVS diodes removed from the replaced brick.

Unfortunately, the coil stopped working again moments after turning on.

This time it tripped the circuit breaker, so is now dead shorting across the bus im assuming.

I have no idea what's happened this time, but perhaps the other IGBT that i never replaced was also on the way out perhaps?

Are you saying that those shorted TVS clamps could have caused the original brick to fail?
Back to top
1 2 

Moderator(s): Chris Russell, Noelle, Alex, Tesladownunder, Dave Marshall, Dave Billington, Bjørn, Steve Conner, Wolfram, Kizmo, Mads Barnkob

Go to:

Powered by e107 Forum System
 
Legal Information
This site is powered by e107, which is released under the GNU GPL License. All work on this site, except where otherwise noted, is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 2.5 License. By submitting any information to this site, you agree that anything submitted will be so licensed. Please read our Disclaimer and Policies page for information on your rights and responsibilities regarding this site.