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Registered Member #193
Joined: Fri Feb 17 2006, 07:04AM
Location: sheffield
Posts: 1022
Chris wrote ...
Well the tetrammine complex has a very distinctive dark/deep blue color, much more so than ordinary copper nitrate, which btw is the only other salt possible here from the selection of ions. So if it has that color, it has TACN. However since it was just from some little copper wires I would guess the tetrammine copper concentration is still much less than the ammonium nitrate concentration, depending on how long it was left to electrolyze anyhow. Complete electrolysis of the solution would yield nothing but nitric acid and copper nitrate I would think, but would take quite a long time.
Clearly it is wisest in any case to air on the side of caution.
Enlighten me What evidence is there for the tetramine complex? It's blue on a blue background.
Registered Member #8
Joined: Thu Feb 02 2006, 04:34AM
Location: Harlowton, MT, United States
Posts: 214
I can't know for sure without pictures, and it might be hard to tell from them even if there were, but the color is fairly distinctive, and much deeper than copper nitrate. Besides, copper (II) and ammonia clearly react to form the tetrammine complex. What evidence do you have that this only happens in arbitrarily concentrated solutions or has not formed here?
Registered Member #193
Joined: Fri Feb 17 2006, 07:04AM
Location: sheffield
Posts: 1022
Without more information there is no way of knowing either way. Continued electrolysis of the solution will strip out the copper so it won't matter anyway, it won't lead to a solution of "nothing but nitric acid and copper nitrate" since the whole point it to make ammonia. If it doesn't make ammonia then there's no chance of forming the tetramine comples.
Registered Member #261
Joined: Mon Feb 27 2006, 12:34AM
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I would agree with Chris; I think it is a tetra-amine complex. However, note two things: It is dilute, and it is in solution. Having these properties, it is fairly benign, you would do best to treat it respectfully, but [Cu(NH3)4]+2 is benign and the nitrate salt is, well, more stable than the perchlorate. At high concentrations, [Cu(NH3)4]+2 is *very* dark. [Cu(H2O)6]+2, which is a copper ion in water, is comparatively light blue and not really dark. Borewd Chemist has suggested that at a low concentration of ammonia, the hexaaqua- ion is prevalent, not the tetraamino. I agree, however, I think you have a solution of tetraamino complex...
EDIT: This paper labels the nitrate salt of Cu-tetraamine a "slow burning salt" as opposed to salts with different anions that are faster burning.
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Electrolysis of aqueous ammonium nitrate solution: what's this blue stuff?
