If you need assistance, please send an email to forum at 4hv dot org. To ensure your email is not marked as spam, please include the phrase "4hv help" in the subject line. You can also find assistance via IRC, at irc.shadowworld.net, room #hvcomm.
Support 4hv.org!
Donate:
4hv.org is hosted on a dedicated server. Unfortunately, this server costs and we rely on the help of site members to keep 4hv.org running. Please consider donating. We will place your name on the thanks list and you'll be helping to keep 4hv.org alive and free for everyone. Members whose names appear in red bold have donated recently. Green bold denotes those who have recently donated to keep the server carbon neutral.
Special Thanks To:
Aaron Holmes
Aaron Wheeler
Adam Horden
Alan Scrimgeour
Andre
Andrew Haynes
Anonymous000
asabase
Austin Weil
barney
Barry
Bert Hickman
Bill Kukowski
Blitzorn
Brandon Paradelas
Bruce Bowling
BubeeMike
Byong Park
Cesiumsponge
Chris F.
Chris Hooper
Corey Worthington
Derek Woodroffe
Dalus
Dan Strother
Daniel Davis
Daniel Uhrenholt
datasheetarchive
Dave Billington
Dave Marshall
David F.
Dennis Rogers
drelectrix
Dr. John Gudenas
Dr. Spark
E.TexasTesla
eastvoltresearch
Eirik Taylor
Erik Dyakov
Erlend^SE
Finn Hammer
Firebug24k
GalliumMan
Gary Peterson
George Slade
GhostNull
Gordon Mcknight
Graham Armitage
Grant
GreySoul
Henry H
IamSmooth
In memory of Leo Powning
Jacob Cash
James Howells
James Pawson
Jeff Greenfield
Jeff Thomas
Jesse Frost
Jim Mitchell
jlr134
Joe Mastroianni
John Forcina
John Oberg
John Willcutt
Jon Newcomb
klugesmith
Leslie Wright
Lutz Hoffman
Mads Barnkob
Martin King
Mats Karlsson
Matt Gibson
Matthew Guidry
mbd
Michael D'Angelo
Mikkel
mileswaldron
mister_rf
Neil Foster
Nick de Smith
Nick Soroka
nicklenorp
Nik
Norman Stanley
Patrick Coleman
Paul Brodie
Paul Jordan
Paul Montgomery
Ped
Peter Krogen
Peter Terren
PhilGood
Richard Feldman
Robert Bush
Royce Bailey
Scott Fusare
Scott Newman
smiffy
Stella
Steven Busic
Steve Conner
Steve Jones
Steve Ward
Sulaiman
Thomas Coyle
Thomas A. Wallace
Thomas W
Timo
Torch
Ulf Jonsson
vasil
Vaxian
vladi mazzilli
wastehl
Weston
William Kim
William N.
William Stehl
Wesley Venis
The aforementioned have contributed financially to the continuing triumph of 4hv.org. They are deserving of my most heartfelt thanks.
Philgood: I did not.....I didn't know it was removable honestly. Do I just take a lighter to it?
That might explain the short thin arcs, yes you must do it, use fine sandpaper to remove enamel on 1cm lenght (make sure you remove enamel all around the wire), then put a new crimp and solder your magnet wire to it.
I can see on your pics you can easilly do it on top of secondary, as you have some spare lenght, I hope you can do the same at the bottom connection of your secondary.
hmm, yea I did not know this, I was wondering what I was suppose to do about that=/
I should have some spare length below too!
Right now I'm moving the whole thing to a more suitable case to enclose it in and more stable. Ill be finishing that up today along with fixing the terry filter, MAYBE will get that new spark gap made if I can figure that out and fix the secondary wires.
And hope to do all this before dark!
Ive got a question on this other spark gap that was mentioned, How do I determine how far the spacing in between them, and then its basically the exact same as wiring like the main gap I have now right?
Registered Member #480
Joined: Thu Jul 06 2006, 07:08PM
Location: North America
Posts: 644
Destroyer -
The response of varisters (MOVs) is more complex than just an ON-OFF switch that triggers at a specific voltage.
First, there is a "varister voltage" rating that is a range of voltage in which the varister first starts to conduct (usually defined as the voltage at which a current of 1ma or .1ma flows; it depends on specific manufacturer and model of MOV).
Second, there is a "clamping voltage" at which the MOV appears as almost a dead short to a voltage spike of a specific risetime.
For the MOVs originally recommended by Terry Fritz (Panasonic ERZ-V10D182), the varister voltage rating is 1700 to 1980 (nominally 1800 volts), while the clamping voltage is 2970 volts.
So, for a Terry filter for a 12kV NST using 14 of these MOVs, the "nominal" varister voltage is 14 * 1800 = 25, 200 volts. If the same filter is using 12 bypass caps "rated" at 1600 VDC, the voltage rating for this string is 12 * 1600, or 19,200 VDC. Of course, the caps have a significant safety margin relative to their 1600 volt "rating", so the MOVs probably do offer some protection, depending on their ACTUAL varister voltage within the 1700 to 1980 "range".
Registered Member #480
Joined: Thu Jul 06 2006, 07:08PM
Location: North America
Posts: 644
IR -
As you get ready to review your coil design in JAVATC, something looks odd with the secondary information you provided. You need to be CERTAIN you know the actual wire gage you used, the number of turns, and the exact diameter of your coilform, to determine the inductance and then the resonant frequency.
You stated that you used "exactly" 1500 feet of wire. How do you know "exactly" what the length of wire is?
You stated that the wire gage is #26 AWG. Are you absolutely certain? (Did you measure it?)
To make sure, MEASURE the OD of your secondary coilform. Also, very carefully count the number of turns in exactly 1 inch of your secondary winding, and multiply this by the total winding length. If your secondary is close-wound, with no gaps between turns, this should give you a failry accurate total turns count. to plug into JAVATC.
As you get ready to review your coil design in JAVATC, something looks odd with the secondary information you provided. You need to be CERTAIN you know the actual wire gage you used, the number of turns, and the exact diameter of your coilform, to determine the inductance and then the resonant frequency.
You stated that you used "exactly" 1500 feet of wire. How do you know "exactly" what the length of wire is?
You stated that the wire gage is #26 AWG. Are you absolutely certain? (Did you measure it?)
To make sure, MEASURE the OD of your secondary coilform. Also, very carefully count the number of turns in exactly 1 inch of your secondary winding, and multiply this by the total winding length. If your secondary is close-wound, with no gaps between turns, this should give you a failry accurate total turns count. to plug into JAVATC.
Herr Zapp
Sorry I didn't respond sooner. I was working on getting the coil fixed.
SO I got the terry filter fixed, works great (So far) I got the magnet wire stripped a little bit and re soldered!
And moved everything to the new cabinet. (Pictures below)
Herr Zapp,
Honestly, im having a hard time trying to figure out how to use that JAVATC.
As for the secondary coil. Im sure the thickness is 26g. Im pretty sure the ID of the PVC is 4" so I guess Ill need to measure the outside. And the exact amount of wire, It may not be 1500 feet cause I left about 1 foot extra on each on for connections before I trimmed them down. So it may be 1498, not sure. As far as how many turns I did, honestly I never counted them. So I dont know how many turns, Ill have to calculate it up from the way you just said it. The coil is very tightly wound with no gaps at all. And also I do know that it was wound for a length of 19 1/2".
But looks like Ill have to determine the rest before plugging the info in.
Oh, when I did fire up the coil this weekend, the terry filter seem to work just fine but I did have another arc somewhere. I'm not sure exactly where or what it came from but it was by the spark gap. I want to assume that the spark gap may have came off the gap and hit one of the fans which hit the metal bracket. But have no idea. Is it possible for the spark gap to jump?
Registered Member #480
Joined: Thu Jul 06 2006, 07:08PM
Location: North America
Posts: 644
IR -
"Honestly, im having a hard time trying to figure out how to use that JAVATC."
Hard time?? It's extremely simple to enter all the parameters you already know. Also, if you get confused, there's a little box with a question mark in it to the left of every input field. Just click on the question mark, and you'll get a detailed explanation of what information to put in each box.
First, just ignore the "Surroundings" section.
Next, enter the data for your secondary coil, after you determine the actual OD of the form.
"Radius 1" is the radius at the bottom of the coilform. Radius is 1/2 * diameter; enter the value. "Radius 2" is the radius at the top of the coilform. Since your coilform is cylindrical, radius 2 is the same as radius 1.
Moving on to the next field, "Height 1" is the height of your lowest secondary winding, relative to the floor. Enter the height. "Height 2" is the height of your highest secondary winding, relative to the floor. Enter the height.
Next, enter the data for your primary coil (ID radius, OD radius, height, etc.).
Topload objects gives you the choice of four different topload topologies; since you have a toroid, enter your toroid's major dia. (the OD), and the minor diameter (diameter or "chord" of your convoluted aluminum tubing), then the centerline height of your toroid, again relative to the floor.
And so on ......
At the end, JAVATC will draw a representation of your coil, calculate a whole list of critical parameters, and provide suggestions for improving performance.
Having the output file from JAVATC is essential to help you any further.
"Honestly, im having a hard time trying to figure out how to use that JAVATC."
Hard time?? It's extremely simple to enter all the parameters you already know. Also, if you get confused, there's a little box with a question mark in it to the left of every input field. Just click on the question mark, and you'll get a detailed explanation of what information to put in each box.
First, just ignore the "Surroundings" section.
Next, enter the data for your secondary coil, after you determine the actual OD of the form.
"Radius 1" is the radius at the bottom of the coilform. Radius is 1/2 * diameter; enter the value. "Radius 2" is the radius at the top of the coilform. Since your coilform is cylindrical, radius 2 is the same as radius 1.
Moving on to the next field, "Height 1" is the height of your lowest secondary winding, relative to the floor. Enter the height. "Height 2" is the height of your highest secondary winding, relative to the floor. Enter the height.
Next, enter the data for your primary coil (ID radius, OD radius, height, etc.).
Topload objects gives you the choice of four different topload topologies; since you have a toroid, enter your toroid's major dia. (the OD), and the minor diameter (diameter or "chord" of your convoluted aluminum tubing), then the centerline height of your toroid, again relative to the floor.
And so on ......
At the end, JAVATC will draw a representation of your coil, calculate a whole list of critical parameters, and provide suggestions for improving performance.
Having the output file from JAVATC is essential to help you any further.
Herr Zapp
Ah okay, I think it was the surrounding section that got me confused. The rest seemed pretty straight forward. I was trying trying to figure out the first section and go down each step. Ill get that done and let you know what I find out!
Registered Member #480
Joined: Thu Jul 06 2006, 07:08PM
Location: North America
Posts: 644
IR -
OK, now that you are starting to look at JAVATC and understand the inputs, go ahead and provide values for the "surroundings" section. These inputs will help refine the accuracy of the resonant frequency calculations.
"Ground Plane Radius" is a bit difficult to define. For a coil that's sitting over earth or concrete, just use a value of 4 or 5 feet.
"Wall Radius" is the distance from the centerline of your secondary to the nearest wall.
"Ceiling Height" is the vertical distance from your ground plane to the ceiling.
Aside from the ground plane, the wall radius and ceiling height are probably not terribly critical unless the wall and ceiling are metal or concrete.
OK, now that you are starting to look at JAVATC and understand the inputs, go ahead and provide values for the "surroundings" section. These inputs will help refine the accuracy of the resonant frequency calculations.
"Ground Plane Radius" is a bit difficult to define. For a coil that's sitting over earth or concrete, just use a value of 4 or 5 feet.
"Wall Radius" is the distance from the centerline of your secondary to the nearest wall.
"Ceiling Height" is the vertical distance from your ground plane to the ceiling.
Aside from the ground plane, the wall radius and ceiling height are probably not terribly critical unless the wall and ceiling are metal or concrete.
Herr Zapp
How do I figure out my closest wall and height if I'm outside?
Registered Member #480
Joined: Thu Jul 06 2006, 07:08PM
Location: North America
Posts: 644
IR -
If any large, potentially conductive objects (trees, cars, brick walls, etc) are more than ~10' from your coil, just ignore them.
Nearby conductive objects couple capacitively to your coil, affect the capacitance between secondary/topload & ground, and affect resonant frequency. As the distance between secondary/topload and these objects increases, their effect on resonant frequency rapidly diminishes.
If any large, potentially conductive objects (trees, cars, brick walls, etc) are more than ~10' from your coil, just ignore them.
Nearby conductive objects couple capacitively to your coil, affect the capacitance between secondary/topload & ground, and affect resonant frequency. As the distance between secondary/topload and these objects increases, their effect on resonant frequency rapidly diminishes.
Herr Zapp
Well I put all the info in for the secondary coil, primary coil and the toriod.
Its been 10 minutes that the program said it was calculating. Suppose to take this long?
This site is powered by e107, which is released under the GNU GPL License. All work on this site, except where otherwise noted, is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 2.5 License. By submitting any information to this site, you agree that anything submitted will be so licensed. Please read our Disclaimer and Policies page for information on your rights and responsibilities regarding this site.
First time Tesla builder, Terry Filter caps popping?
