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Forums
4hv.org :: Forums :: High Voltage
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power transfer through thin wires

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Steve Conner
Thu Jan 19 2012, 08:15AM
Steve Conner Registered Member #30 Joined: Fri Feb 03 2006, 10:52AM
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 6706
Sure it is, that's why I recommended to modify a surplus one instead of building from scratch. 48V is a standard voltage after all.

As luck would have it, the same guy who did the microhydro system also has two DIY SMPS projects on his site. However they are old designs using BJTs.

Taking a step back and looking at the problem on the system level: Would it really be that hard to just make the tether wires a bit thicker (or reduce your ROV's power budget) so you can feed 220V, 50Hz, or 320V DC down it, into an unmodified 220V to 48V SMPS.

If feeding 220V AC down there, do choose a SMPS with a PFC front end as this will reduce the RMS current in the wires.
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0joze0
Thu Jan 19 2012, 11:24AM
0joze0 Registered Member #4346 Joined: Tue Jan 17 2012, 10:16AM
Location: Slovenia
Posts: 9
what is equation for calculating losses on cable ?
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Dr. ISOTOP
Thu Jan 19 2012, 12:41PM
Dr. ISOTOP Registered Member #2919 Joined: Fri Jun 11 2010, 06:30PM
Location: Cambridge, MA
Posts: 652
0joze0 wrote ...

what is equation for calculating losses on cable ?

I'm pretty sure its just standard I^2R losses...
At line voltage (~300VDC) you need to send 8A, which corresponds to 300W of losses in the cable.
Run a voltage doubler and you'll only need 4A, which is just 80W of losses.
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m4ge123
Thu Jan 19 2012, 02:22PM
m4ge123 Registered Member #4118 Joined: Mon Oct 03 2011, 04:50PM
Location: MD
Posts: 140
Actually, 8A is about 600W of losses. You forgot to account for the current coming back through another 5 ohms of wire.
It shouldn't be too hard to design a switching converter. Just calculate your component values with this Link2 and use a TL494 for feedback.
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radiotech
Fri Jan 20 2012, 02:21AM
radiotech Registered Member #2463 Joined: Wed Nov 11 2009, 03:49AM
Location:
Posts: 1546
Rework your calculations with a transformer at each end : 220/2300 3 kW
is a common size of single phase unit.

How are the wires supported or insulated, or are you trying to power something underwater?
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0joze0
Fri Jan 20 2012, 09:04AM
0joze0 Registered Member #4346 Joined: Tue Jan 17 2012, 10:16AM
Location: Slovenia
Posts: 9
I will use high voltage insulated wires, inside the cable I will also have fibre for data transmission.
Yes, this is for underwater use-ROV
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Adam Munich
Fri Jan 20 2012, 08:03PM
Adam Munich Registered Member #2893 Joined: Tue Jun 01 2010, 09:25PM
Location: Cali-forn. i. a.
Posts: 2242
It sounds like the easiest and most reliable option would be to use 2 matched microwave oven transformers.

500mA at 2kV is 1kW.
10ohm^2 * .5 == 50 watts lost.

Are there weight constraints for this ROV? I'd suspect not, since any buoyancy issues could be resolved with a bit more air in the ballast.

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Sulaiman
Fri Jan 20 2012, 08:09PM
Sulaiman Registered Member #162 Joined: Mon Feb 13 2006, 10:25AM
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 3141
Since weight is not a problem,
what is the problem with battery power?
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radiotech
Fri Jan 20 2012, 08:36PM
radiotech Registered Member #2463 Joined: Wed Nov 11 2009, 03:49AM
Location:
Posts: 1546
If it is a bottom crawling vehicle weight would not be a problem going down. However,
coming up, the issue of catastrophic failure could be handled by an air bladder which
might be inflated through tubing provided in the umbilical cord.

Because of the shunts in MOTs, I dont think they transform equally well in
both directions.
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Adam Munich
Fri Jan 20 2012, 08:39PM
Adam Munich Registered Member #2893 Joined: Tue Jun 01 2010, 09:25PM
Location: Cali-forn. i. a.
Posts: 2242
As far as underwater boats go, buoyancy is usually controlled pneumatically. Have an air bladder, a tank and a compressor.

Compress the air in a tank, air bladder deflates and system becomes less buoyant. Let the air back into the bladder and the vessel floats.

A long line of hose is more trouble than it's worth.
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