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4hv.org :: Forums :: High Voltage
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A Question About Turns^2 and AL...

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Patrick
Fri Dec 23 2011, 10:03PM
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
eventually 30-40kV via 4 or 5 seriesed secondaries, but the first few prototypes may be less, 15-20kV

About 15 to 30 mA
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Wolfram
Sat Dec 24 2011, 03:37PM
Wolfram Registered Member #33 Joined: Sat Feb 04 2006, 01:31PM
Location: Norway
Posts: 971
I'm not really sure what you're asking, but I don't think L6 will affect things too much. If I understand your schematics right, L6 represents the leakage inductance as seen from the secondary side. As the load resistance will be much larger than the reactance of this inductance at any reasonable operating frequency, the Q of the resonant circuit formed by L6 and C1 will be very low, so you won't see any resonance effects here. The high-frequency rolloff formed by L6 and the load resistance will be way above the resonance frequency of the leakage inductance and the reflected secondary capacitance anyways. I don't really know where that model is from, but I assume the unmarked resistor represents the load. Focus on what's important. C1, L10 and the turns ratio is what mainly determines your resonance frequency, and that's what limits your operating frequency.

As to how multiple secondaries affect the resonance frequency, that's a good question (if that's what you're asking, I'm having a hard time understanding your post). As long as the secondaries are isolated from each other from an AC perspective (like if you rectify each secondary separately, then series them), the reflected capacitance as seen from the primary side should be m*n^2*Csec where m is the number of secondaries and n is the step-up ratio from the primary to a single secondary. The leakage inductance will also change, I suspect it will be L/m where L is the leakage inductance with a single secondary and m is the number of secondaries. This is the bit I'm a bit more unsure about. If this assumption holds true, the resonant frequency should not change with multiple secondaries, AS LONG AS each one is rectified separately.

Just winding a single secondary and measuring the resonance frequency you end up with is probably a lot easier than trying to calculate it. If my predictions hold true, the resonant frequency with multiple secondaries shouldn't be radically different, so winding a single one for testing should give you a good idea.

You still haven't answered my question about your intended operating frequency, in one post you mentioned 10-40kHz, in an other you mentioned 100kHz.

Please stick to one transformer model, as I and several others have mentioned, leakage inductance and reflected capacitance are the main factors determining if your design will work or not at the intended operating frequency. Mixing several different transformer models into the equation just adds confusion.
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Patrick
Sat Dec 24 2011, 11:52PM
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
Ok nearing completion of the first coil...

from now on ill use this schematic...

1324611812 2431 FT1630 0509understanding Fig03


design standards are:

1) 6.5kV secondary, 600 turns.
2) 11 volts per turn on the ferrite core.
3) 500W or greater of power throughput.
4) Sec insulation to core = 120kV, pri to sec insulation = 120kV, end to end = 20kV. (mylar, multi-layer) under oil.
5) 1 turn primary, if possible.
6) Output current should be about 30mA.
7) Operating freq will be 100kHz. (for the transformer)
8) Half bridge or CT-PP transistor drive (quadrants 1 and 3)
9) Core loss at 100kHz, +/-2300G, is 500mW/cc for my planar ferrite. (TSC 50-ALL)
10) the transistors and primaries will be clocked and synced, in parallel, via the UC28025DWG4 IC.
11) Current transformer, and pulse by pulse I limit, for safety.
12) Secondary will be 35 Awg wire, primary will be 0.350" wide 0.003" think copper foil. (skin and proximity effect at 100kHz make these neccesary.)

The secondaries will be seriesed, to reach about 40kV. Planars will be oil submerged for cooling, max temp will be 90 C for normal continuous operation. (Im hoping for 25-30 C core rise, above ambient oil temp.) Coils will be made by Radhoo's method #3, and imobilized with my favorite slow epoxy.

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Patrick
Tue Dec 27 2011, 06:36AM
Patrick Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639
i have new madrel blanks i made while with the parents for Xmas.

first coils are crap, ill keep trying thjough.


1324967780 2431 FT130330 Sam 0811
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