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Nuclear events taking place in Japan.

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Ash Small

Tue Apr 12 2011, 12:33AM

Registered Member #3414 Joined: Sun Nov 14 2010, 05:05PM
Location: UK
Posts: 4245

BBC: Fukushima may be raised to 'level 7' , same as Chernobyl.

Steve Conner

Tue Apr 12 2011, 08:21AM

Registered Member #30 Joined: Fri Feb 03 2006, 10:52AM
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 6706

According to BBC news, it is now officially Level 7. Highest rating on the nuclear disaster scale.

Ash Small

Tue Apr 12 2011, 08:49AM

Registered Member #3414 Joined: Sun Nov 14 2010, 05:05PM
Location: UK
Posts: 4245

BBC:

"Level seven previously only applied to the 1986 Chernobyl disaster, where 10 times as much radiation was emitted"

"One official from Tepco said that radiation leaks had not stopped completely and could eventually exceed those at Chernobyl, Reuters news agency reported."

"However, a nuclear safety agency spokesman told reporters the leaks were still small compared to those at the plant in Ukraine, then part of the Soviet Union.

"In terms of volume of radioactive materials released, our estimate shows it is about 10% of what was released by Chernobyl," he said.

The decision to raise the threat level was made after radiation of a total up to 630,000 terabequerels had been estimated at the stricken plant.

That would classify the crisis at level seven on the International Nuclear and Radiological Event Scale (Ines).

It was not clear when that level had been reached. The level has subsequently dropped to less than one terabequerel an hour, reports said.

In comparison the Japanese government said the release from Chernobyl was 5.2 million terabecquerels."

klugesmith

Tue Apr 12 2011, 10:14PM

Registered Member #2099 Joined: Wed Apr 29 2009, 12:22AM
Location: Los Altos, California
Posts: 1716

I'm having trouble with the numbers.

Estimated leakage to date = 630,000 TBq = 17 megacuries. That's a serious amount of radioactivity (most of which should have decayed by now).

Stated total from Chernobyl = 5.2 million TBq = 141 megacuries.

"The level has subsequently dropped to less than one terabequerel an hour, reports said."
That's 27 curies/hour. At that rate it would take at least 72 years to double the Fukushima leakage to date, and over 500 years to match Chernobyl.

Patrick

Wed Apr 13 2011, 01:41AM

Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639

Klugesmith wrote ...

I'm having trouble with the numbers.

Estimated leakage to date = 630,000 TBq = 17 megacuries. That's a serious amount of radioactivity (most of which should have decayed by now).

Stated total from Chernobyl = 5.2 million TBq = 141 megacuries.

"The level has subsequently dropped to less than one terabequerel an hour, reports said."
That's 27 curies/hour. At that rate it would take at least 72 years to double the Fukushima leakage to date, and over 500 years to match Chernobyl.

I presume that the rate of emission is not constant, but fluctuates wildly throughout the day, night, heat cold, wind speed direction. These factors are outside the facilitybut act on it, while there would also be changes in avaiable radiation to be scattered off site. These would be on-site factors. like fuel ponds being filled with water then emptied and so on.

Or... there are two possiblities I see:

First, perhaps the reported number (1Tbeq/Hr) is a botched fact, i am certain some of these idiot media people are being told a "number/unit" by a good source, then they quickly screw it up on camera or in print.

Second, perhaps the fukushima upper corporate people and/or governement sources are either holding back on known values, or there totally guessing.

Steve Conner

Wed Apr 13 2011, 10:04AM

Registered Member #30 Joined: Fri Feb 03 2006, 10:52AM
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 6706

Well, here is an interesting analysis from "Neon" JohnDeArmond, who turns out to be a nuclear industry veteran who worked on the Three Mile Island restart program.

Note that Tepco publish all of their radiation survey results online.

And two surprising editorials from the Guardian. George Monbiot admits that microgeneration sucks and comes out in favour of nuclear?!

I guess he has learned to stop worrying and love the bomb.

Patrick

Wed Apr 13 2011, 05:38PM

Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639

Steve McConner wrote ...

Well, here is an interesting analysis from "Neon" JohnDeArmond, who turns out to be a nuclear industry veteran who worked on the Three Mile Island restart program.

But in this article he admits he cant comment usefully on physical internal isotopes absorbed by the body. I dont believe anyone with half a brain is concerend with gamma emission external to the body a the 5uSv/Hr rate. I am terrified at the thought of radioactive isotopes inhaled, eaten, on surface skin contact and so on. Atoms carried by the wind are the greatest factor in decideding the harmful from harmless. Though I do agree with the Threshold Theory and maybe Hormesis, but LNT is just anti-nuke crap.

Steve McConner wrote ...

Note that Tepco publish all of their radiation survey results online.

You would have to presuppose that TEPCO has released the right information, and that if there were harmfull levels that they would release that info to the public too. I am highly skeptical of TEPCO given their past 2 decades. (accidents, defrauding the japanese government, falsifying compliance statements etc.)

Steve McConner wrote ...

And two surprising editorials from the Guardian. George Monbiot admits that microgeneration sucks and comes out in favour of nuclear?!

I guess he has learned to stop worrying and love the bomb.

This article is an absolute indictment of the dishonest Anti-nuke people. I have been at campuses like that of UC Berkely, and been told that: "Every year smoke detectors cause 100,000 lung cancer deaths per year across the US." Which is a deliberate lie.

Steve Conner

Wed Apr 13 2011, 06:03PM

Registered Member #30 Joined: Fri Feb 03 2006, 10:52AM
Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Posts: 6706

Patrick wrote ...

I have been at campuses like that of UC Berkely, and been told that: "Every year smoke detectors cause 100,000 lung cancer deaths per year across the US." Which is a deliberate lie.

That's insane!

I don't think even cigarettes cause that many lung cancer deaths.

Ash Small

Wed Apr 13 2011, 07:25PM

Registered Member #3414 Joined: Sun Nov 14 2010, 05:05PM
Location: UK
Posts: 4245

I agree with Patrick here, the REAL threat from Fukushima is if radioactive isotopes, especially plutonium, reach the water table, and enter the water supply.

I'm not even sure if alpha emitters like plutonium could be detected in fish, etc, as the radiation wouldn't reach a detector.

Apparently, plutonium, once in the body, is fixed by the blood, and remains in the body permanently, irradiating the whole body as the blood flows around.

Patrick

Wed Apr 13 2011, 09:55PM

Registered Member #2431 Joined: Tue Oct 13 2009, 09:47PM
Location: Chico, CA. USA
Posts: 5639

Steve McConner wrote ...

That's insane!

I don't think even cigarettes cause that many lung cancer deaths.

Not just insane, but bazarre. Ive seen the same people on two diffferent occasions use different numbers for the same bogus quote. I assume its because they cant keep track of the many lies they tell.

What is so dangerous is that these political, activist, protest groups and such, that make these wild claims are contributing or at least influencing public policy, which should be based on real science and fact. instead pro-nuclear groups and anti-nuclear groups are allowed to have the same wheight and credibility as real scientists/engineering people and groups with real peer reviewed original work.

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