What should go in the Wiki?
Steve Conner, Sat Sept 01 2007, 12:00PMHi all,
I notice that a lot of articles being added to the wiki are covering topics that are covered in detail elsewhere. For instance, the article on "Real Numbers"
is just a mini version of something that Wikipedia covers in much more detail.If the wiki is to be "4hv The Book" then surely the bulk of effort should go into writing up knowledge that 4hv itself has created. For instance, compare the article on "Dual Resonant Solid-State Tesla Coil"
or any of the articles on coilgun simulation. These are all more or less based on original work by 4hv members.Note, this is only IMO and intended to spark debate on the issue.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
thedatastream, Sat Sept 01 2007, 04:48PM
Size of wiki != quality of wiki
thedatastream, Sat Sept 01 2007, 04:48PM
Size of wiki != quality of wiki
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Bjørn, Sat Sept 01 2007, 06:38PM
It is possible that there is no need for a Real number article, it might be better to include the relevant information in the floating-point article. If an article that contains basic information has only one link to it then it might be better to include the information in the article that links to it. The cut off point is going to be arbitrary and depend on the different people writing the articles and since it is unlikely that any category is going to get crowded there is no harm in it yet.
The long term plan is that the forum will automatically link to articles in the wiki and for the wiki to answer all the common beginners questions so they don't end up on the forum. So the wiki should contain articles that is useful for people reading a post about something they are learning about. The articles should not be in the form they are in wikipedia. The information should be accessible for people that are learning about the subject and skip information that is irrelevant in the context.
So in general there should be articles covering the categories from the most basic like charging a capacitor with a 9V battery to the most advanced Tesla coil theory. It would probably not work brilliantly in a book so I suggest creating a new category with a definition of what goes into the book. Then it is just a matter of adding the category tag to the end of the articles that should go in the book. This sort of thing is what a wiki is very good at.
Bjørn, Sat Sept 01 2007, 06:38PM
It is possible that there is no need for a Real number article, it might be better to include the relevant information in the floating-point article. If an article that contains basic information has only one link to it then it might be better to include the information in the article that links to it. The cut off point is going to be arbitrary and depend on the different people writing the articles and since it is unlikely that any category is going to get crowded there is no harm in it yet.
The long term plan is that the forum will automatically link to articles in the wiki and for the wiki to answer all the common beginners questions so they don't end up on the forum. So the wiki should contain articles that is useful for people reading a post about something they are learning about. The articles should not be in the form they are in wikipedia. The information should be accessible for people that are learning about the subject and skip information that is irrelevant in the context.
So in general there should be articles covering the categories from the most basic like charging a capacitor with a 9V battery to the most advanced Tesla coil theory. It would probably not work brilliantly in a book so I suggest creating a new category with a definition of what goes into the book. Then it is just a matter of adding the category tag to the end of the articles that should go in the book. This sort of thing is what a wiki is very good at.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Alessandro, Sat Sept 01 2007, 10:56PM
I agree, there is no point including articles which are much better written elsewhere. We need to focus on the material that does not exist already. Information relevant to the forum, I can't recall anyone asking about Real numbers but people ask about High Voltage, Tesla Coils, Coilguns etc all the time. This is the material we should be focusing on.
The Wiki also needs to be more of an instruction book. Wikipedia itself is just a knowledge base, which is fine because its readers are in search of information. Whereas people come here to learn how to build things. Don't get me wrong, we need information, but we also need practical guides on using it. A newbie might get pointed to a wiki article but if it's all facts he/her will still post a question on how to something.
Just my $0.02
Alessandro, Sat Sept 01 2007, 10:56PM
I agree, there is no point including articles which are much better written elsewhere. We need to focus on the material that does not exist already. Information relevant to the forum, I can't recall anyone asking about Real numbers but people ask about High Voltage, Tesla Coils, Coilguns etc all the time. This is the material we should be focusing on.
The Wiki also needs to be more of an instruction book. Wikipedia itself is just a knowledge base, which is fine because its readers are in search of information. Whereas people come here to learn how to build things. Don't get me wrong, we need information, but we also need practical guides on using it. A newbie might get pointed to a wiki article but if it's all facts he/her will still post a question on how to something.
Just my $0.02
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Chris Russell, Sun Sept 02 2007, 12:32AM
The real numbers article seems okay to me, though we might consider merging it into an article that describes all the major sets of numbers. It's a valid article, and it is a question that might arise for someone who is programming. I think it falls within the scope of the wiki. Don't forget, there's more to 4hv than Tesla coils and coil guns. Where do we draw the line? I'm not sure that we even should, yet. We are in no danger of overwhelming the wiki with too much information. As long as people use the topics covered by 4hv as a guide, I think we will be okay for now.
For right now, the wiki is a knowledge base, not a how to guide. There's a significant amount of knowledge that can be found here on 4hv and not on wikipedia. The DRSSTC article linked above is an excellent example; compare it with . However, we may want to look at creating a "how to" category, which could then be populated with articles that spell out how to do things step-by-step. An article such as "how to wind a Tesla coil secondary" could answer a lot of newbie questions, and allow 4hv people to pool what must amount to thousands of man hours of experience in winding.
Would there be any interest in a "how to" category? It might prove very useful, if people are willing to craft some articles for it.
Chris Russell, Sun Sept 02 2007, 12:32AM
The real numbers article seems okay to me, though we might consider merging it into an article that describes all the major sets of numbers. It's a valid article, and it is a question that might arise for someone who is programming. I think it falls within the scope of the wiki. Don't forget, there's more to 4hv than Tesla coils and coil guns. Where do we draw the line? I'm not sure that we even should, yet. We are in no danger of overwhelming the wiki with too much information. As long as people use the topics covered by 4hv as a guide, I think we will be okay for now.
The Wiki also needs to be more of an instruction book. Wikipedia itself is just a knowledge base, which is fine because its readers are in search of information.
For right now, the wiki is a knowledge base, not a how to guide. There's a significant amount of knowledge that can be found here on 4hv and not on wikipedia. The DRSSTC article linked above is an excellent example; compare it with
. However, we may want to look at creating a "how to" category, which could then be populated with articles that spell out how to do things step-by-step. An article such as "how to wind a Tesla coil secondary" could answer a lot of newbie questions, and allow 4hv people to pool what must amount to thousands of man hours of experience in winding.Would there be any interest in a "how to" category? It might prove very useful, if people are willing to craft some articles for it.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Alessandro, Sun Sept 02 2007, 02:26AM
I would be very interested in a "How To" category. An idea I had is that if it would be possible to assign each article a Basic Intermediate or Advanced level depending on its content. Also the ability to show/hide articles based on their level. This would allow a newcomer, for example to choose to only view Basic articles while browsing; How to solder, Ohms law etc. While advanced members wouldn't have to wade through basic stuff. This is assuming the wiki becomes large enough to warrant this.
Another idea is creating a list of "Top Contributors" possibly based how much information each person adds to the Wiki. Bringing a sense of competition and being the "Highest Contributor" and named as so might encourage people to work on the Wiki more.
Just some random ideas.
Alessandro, Sun Sept 02 2007, 02:26AM
I would be very interested in a "How To" category. An idea I had is that if it would be possible to assign each article a Basic Intermediate or Advanced level depending on its content. Also the ability to show/hide articles based on their level. This would allow a newcomer, for example to choose to only view Basic articles while browsing; How to solder, Ohms law etc. While advanced members wouldn't have to wade through basic stuff. This is assuming the wiki becomes large enough to warrant this.
Another idea is creating a list of "Top Contributors" possibly based how much information each person adds to the Wiki. Bringing a sense of competition and being the "Highest Contributor" and named as so might encourage people to work on the Wiki more.
Just some random ideas.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
thedatastream, Sun Sept 02 2007, 09:05AM
"How To" sounds like a really good idea. Having "How To" as a category would also work. One possible problem arising from this is having a suitable disclaimer (unless we have one already). Making it clear that this is for information only and having a safety guide would also be good
There's nothing wrong with having entries on real numbers and the like but IMO the articles aim should be to
a) reference already well written articles on the subject
b) show how they can be applied to our areas of interest
thedatastream, Sun Sept 02 2007, 09:05AM
"How To" sounds like a really good idea. Having "How To" as a category would also work. One possible problem arising from this is having a suitable disclaimer (unless we have one already). Making it clear that this is for information only and having a safety guide would also be good
There's nothing wrong with having entries on real numbers and the like but IMO the articles aim should be to
a) reference already well written articles on the subject
b) show how they can be applied to our areas of interest
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Steve Conner, Sun Sept 02 2007, 11:04AM
Yes, I also vote for a Howto category. Let's keep this thread going, IMO, it's asking questions that need to be asked
Steve Conner, Sun Sept 02 2007, 11:04AM
Yes, I also vote for a Howto category. Let's keep this thread going, IMO, it's asking questions that need to be asked
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
WaveRider, Sun Sept 02 2007, 11:49AM
Yes, I think a specific HOWTO section is a great idea!
Also, I must apologise for my lack of activity on the Wiki. I kinda left all that mathematical stuff hanging.. My intention was (is) to cover aspects of electromagnetic modeling in an HV context which requires a certain mathematical background to tackle (hence the maths stuff). Uni students may find it interesting, but the general 4HV audience may find it tedious. What do you think? I will make an effort to fill the discussion out if you think it is appropriate and may be useful.
Since we all do this in our limited spare time, feedback is important to everyone to keep up the motivation to attempt to prepare quality material on sometimes involved topics.
My philosophy on the Wiki is to make advanced topics available to everyone who wishes to understand them while simultaneously providing the basic information needed for beginners to get a positive start in electronics, electrodynamics.
WaveRider, Sun Sept 02 2007, 11:49AM
Yes, I think a specific HOWTO section is a great idea!
Also, I must apologise for my lack of activity on the Wiki. I kinda left all that mathematical stuff hanging.. My intention was (is) to cover aspects of electromagnetic modeling in an HV context which requires a certain mathematical background to tackle (hence the maths stuff). Uni students may find it interesting, but the general 4HV audience may find it tedious. What do you think? I will make an effort to fill the discussion out if you think it is appropriate and may be useful.
Since we all do this in our limited spare time, feedback is important to everyone to keep up the motivation to attempt to prepare quality material on sometimes involved topics.
My philosophy on the Wiki is to make advanced topics available to everyone who wishes to understand them while simultaneously providing the basic information needed for beginners to get a positive start in electronics, electrodynamics.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Chris Russell, Sun Sept 02 2007, 07:16PM
Great, sounds like there is more than enough support for a "how to" section, then. I think we'll just start with a single category, then expand it into subcategories if and when we need to.
I'm currently working on an upgrade for the wiki, along with a way to mesh the forum and wiki user databases together, thus eliminating the need for seperate signups. Anyone who is waiting to sign up and start on the wiki, please be patient, as I think the result will really streamline the process.
Chris Russell, Sun Sept 02 2007, 07:16PM
Great, sounds like there is more than enough support for a "how to" section, then. I think we'll just start with a single category, then expand it into subcategories if and when we need to.
I'm currently working on an upgrade for the wiki, along with a way to mesh the forum and wiki user databases together, thus eliminating the need for seperate signups. Anyone who is waiting to sign up and start on the wiki, please be patient, as I think the result will really streamline the process.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Bjørn, Sun Sept 02 2007, 08:47PM
Continue to ask questions and come up with ideas, it is very helpful.
The advanced math will always go over the head of most people but that does not mean it is not valuable. It is better that one person finds something very useful than that 1000 people understands something that is not praticulary useful to them. We should make an effort to write the articles such that by reading the first paragraphs it will be completely clear what the purpose and general idea is so that people instantly can find out if this is the information they were looking for.
When the articles range from the most basic to the most advanced we have a nice ladder that means people can develop for a long time, we will also have a good mix of different people finding us on google which is good for the forum.
Bjørn, Sun Sept 02 2007, 08:47PM
Continue to ask questions and come up with ideas, it is very helpful.
The advanced math will always go over the head of most people but that does not mean it is not valuable. It is better that one person finds something very useful than that 1000 people understands something that is not praticulary useful to them. We should make an effort to write the articles such that by reading the first paragraphs it will be completely clear what the purpose and general idea is so that people instantly can find out if this is the information they were looking for.
When the articles range from the most basic to the most advanced we have a nice ladder that means people can develop for a long time, we will also have a good mix of different people finding us on google which is good for the forum.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Simon, Mon Sept 03 2007, 01:09AM
Articles should also start off general and low level and work up to the gritty details. I know not everyone is as hard core about maths as me and some people actually get scared by curly calculus symbols.
After thinking about it, the How To sections sounds like a good idea. The problem I see is people writing hugely broad articles like "How to Design and Build a Coilgun". We'll have to make sure the section sticks to specific articles like, "How to Make a Beginner's Coilgun from a Disposable Camera" and that these articles simply feed off the major pages, rather than competing with them.
Simon, Mon Sept 03 2007, 01:09AM
Articles should also start off general and low level and work up to the gritty details. I know not everyone is as hard core about maths as me and some people actually get scared by curly calculus symbols.
After thinking about it, the How To sections sounds like a good idea. The problem I see is people writing hugely broad articles like "How to Design and Build a Coilgun". We'll have to make sure the section sticks to specific articles like, "How to Make a Beginner's Coilgun from a Disposable Camera" and that these articles simply feed off the major pages, rather than competing with them.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Bjørn, Sun Feb 17 2008, 05:42PM
Does any of you new members have anything to say about this? The old members have grown older yet and new people with new ideas are needed to keep the momentum going.
Bjørn, Sun Feb 17 2008, 05:42PM
Does any of you new members have anything to say about this? The old members have grown older yet and new people with new ideas are needed to keep the momentum going.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Bjørn, Thu Feb 21 2008, 01:23PM
I created the How to category and added one article.
Mates did an excellent job on the pictures and descriptions. Let me know if there are any other projects that are suitable for adding to the How to category.
Bjørn, Thu Feb 21 2008, 01:23PM
I created the How to category and added one article.
Mates did an excellent job on the pictures and descriptions. Let me know if there are any other projects that are suitable for adding to the How to category.
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
flannelhead, Thu Feb 21 2008, 03:01PM
Excellent!
The howto-category is exactly what HvWiki has been lacking of. Hopefully there will be many articles from coilguns to SSTCs and so on. That would be great reference material for beginners wanting to build hv devices. But remember also, when writing articles there, to include the safety part!
Keep up the good work
flannelhead, Thu Feb 21 2008, 03:01PM
Excellent!
The howto-category is exactly what HvWiki has been lacking of. Hopefully there will be many articles from coilguns to SSTCs and so on. That would be great reference material for beginners wanting to build hv devices. But remember also, when writing articles there, to include the safety part!
Keep up the good work
Re: What should go in the Wiki?
Chris Cristini, Sun Apr 19 2009, 02:55PM
I know this thread is a little old but we should revive it for a start I can post. (How to build a computer.)
I can supply pictures of the process and information what do you think?
(How to build layden jar capacitors)
(How to wind a new primary for your fly back transformer)
(How to build a chicken stick)
(How to troubleshoot Electronic Circuits)
(How to wind a toroidal inductor)
Chris Cristini, Sun Apr 19 2009, 02:55PM
Bjørn wrote ...
I created the How to category and added one article.
Mates did an excellent job on the pictures and descriptions. Let me know if there are any other projects that are suitable for adding to the How to category.
I created the How to category and added one article.
Mates did an excellent job on the pictures and descriptions. Let me know if there are any other projects that are suitable for adding to the How to category.
I know this thread is a little old but we should revive it for a start I can post. (How to build a computer.)
I can supply pictures of the process and information what do you think?
(How to build layden jar capacitors)
(How to wind a new primary for your fly back transformer)
(How to build a chicken stick)
(How to troubleshoot Electronic Circuits)
(How to wind a toroidal inductor)
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