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The problem with dangerous chemicals

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Carbon_Rod

Tue Apr 25 2017, 09:17PM

Registered Member #65 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 06:43AM
Location:
Posts: 1155

Conundrum wrote ...

No amount of reconstructive surgery can repair this, in India its a real problem that unfortunately is complicated by
artisanal gold mining often from illegally imported e-waste from Europe and elsewhere sent over in bulk in total defiance
of the Basel convention with the residual heavy metals ending up in rivers and slowly poisoning folks.

If you ever visit India, than you will understand why those with talent leave. The absurd consequences of centuries of caste systems have warped tribalism to unknown lows. People wash their hands in cow urine because it's cleaner than the water, cut off children's limbs to improve tourist begging revenue, and disfigure women with acid for fiscal or social motives.

The place does have a few developed regions with modern cultural standards, but the other 90% are living in their own filth as proven by the red zoned infectious diseases world map.

Pollution and worker safety doesn't enter consideration if your very survival is at stake.
The place is mostly primitive, dangerous at times, and disgusting to endure.
=(

Hazmatt_(The Underdog)

Wed Apr 26 2017, 03:25AM

Registered Member #135 Joined: Sat Feb 11 2006, 12:06AM
Location: Anywhere is fine
Posts: 1735

Creating a Nanny state is just throwing the baby out with the bath water, it hurts everyone.

Really all you are doing is protecting the stupid and gullible, and allowing them to breed, is that a world you want to live in?

Do you want to have to show your driver's license to buy table salt?

dexter

Wed Apr 26 2017, 07:07AM

Registered Member #42796 Joined: Mon Jan 13 2014, 06:34PM
Location:
Posts: 195

Conundrum wrote ...

in India its a real problem...

well in the rest of the world (or at least in EU/US) it's not a problem... so
why a problem that is exclusive to India should be used to push legislation in european countries?

the_anomaly

Thu Apr 27 2017, 02:15AM

Registered Member #19 Joined: Thu Feb 02 2006, 03:19PM
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 168

By introducing rules and regulations I think you will stifle innovation from garage inventors but you might also protect some of the general public.

Many chemicals a hobbyist might be interested in are 'dangerous' but when you compare them to some household chemicals they are about on par. ie. you would not drink bleach so treat copper sulfate the same.

I think steep punishment works to deter when the perpetrator knows of it. IMO many crimes are committed without thought of the consequences.

Conundrum

Thu Apr 27 2017, 06:59AM

Registered Member #96 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 05:37PM
Location: CI, Earth
Posts: 4059

There is a difference between educating people (a good example: providing MSDS sheets *EVERY TIME* they make a purchase) and/or at least having some monitoring. So if some idiot goes and buys high concentration H2SO4 they have to hand over their passport and if requested explain what they are doing with it, ideally demonstrating at least some level of knowledge.

I recall the same argument being made for restricting Li primary batteries and Sudafed, for similar reasons.
Guess what happened, the gangs making meth simply change their processes to get around restrictions: in some cities you can't even buy Lemsip now without ID and packet sizes are limited to also reduce the incidence of paracetamol poisoning.
I did hear that the latest method being used is to harvest Li from discarded LiPo model pouch cells, by charging up several times in a domestic freezer to 4.35V then mix it with Mg to reduce the chance of accidental ignition.
As an aside this technique is easily detected as leaking electrolyte typically shows up on a mass spectrometer to prove someone has been handling large quantities of cells.

Interesting factoid: recycling useful metals from discarded 18650s is also feasible and freezing the cell(s) before harvesting is a good way to make sure any unwanted reaction is controlled.
This is actually extensively used in industry and some new Energizers are made from recycled materials.

Hazmatt_(The Underdog)

Fri Apr 28 2017, 01:26AM

Registered Member #135 Joined: Sat Feb 11 2006, 12:06AM
Location: Anywhere is fine
Posts: 1735

And how do you propose to train the interrogator?

These are just regular folks working for $11/hr. trying to get by, they don't know the hazards, that's why they are working at Home Depot.

Look, I worked at Home Depot during a remodel in 2006. A forklift driver knocked over 16 cases of 32% HCL ( 32 gallons! ) in the garden area (pool acid by the way) during our inspection by the district manager.

The next thing you see is his dumb ass in the middle of the spill pool dumping the bicarbonate spill pack on the mess wearing a 2 filter respirator.

The dumb shit nearly asphyxiated himself on the chlorine, I'm sure his eyes were killing him that night.

All the while I was yelling at him to get the Lye drain cleaner, and the caustic based drain cleaner liquid concentrate.

No you can't educate the masses, they are just mindless consumers, so forget it. This kind of crusading is a waste of time, unless you're really the type that thinks their kids need to be bubble-wrapped before going outside.

The world needs to toughen-up a bit right now, that's why Berkeley is in such a mess.

Conundrum

Fri Aug 11 2017, 05:28AM

Registered Member #96 Joined: Thu Feb 09 2006, 05:37PM
Location: CI, Earth
Posts: 4059

Its hard enough to get components now.
There were discussions about banning Arduinos (!) but fortunately the people in charge saw sense.
(re. reused consumer parts being found in the Mideast or something like that)

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